Talk:Florence Ashley

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List of useful media articles to be added.

The following is a (currently unsorted) list of useful media articles that could be added in various parts of the article:

• https://xtramagazine.com/culture/trans-conversion-practices-florence-ashley-220924
• https://www.thestar.com/opinion/contributors/2021/10/19/you-can-say-woman-and-we-can-say-person.html
• https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/anti-transgender-narratives-canada-1.6232947
• https://www.wired.com/story/for-marginalized-groups-being-studied-can-be-a-burden/
• https://transsafety.network/posts/florence-ashley-conversion-book-interview/
• https://nationalmagazine.ca/en-ca/articles/people/profiles/2019/en-gendering-change
• https://www.uc.utoronto.ca/news/amplifying-trans-voices - 2021 Trans day of visibility interview
• https://www.who.int/news/item/18-12-2023-who-announces-the-development-of-a-guideline-on-the-health-of-trans-and-gender-diverse-people
• https://cdn.who.int/media/docs/default-source/hq-hiv-hepatitis-and-stis-library/biographies_tgd-gdg_proposed_members_2024.pdf?sfvrsn=5b1e7491_3
• https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12917509/WHO-accused-trans-bias-calling-self-ID-right-transgender-care.html
• https://xtramagazine.com/culture/be-gay-do-crime-explained-263699

The following is a (currently unsorted) list of secondary articles citing Ahsley:

• https://nationalpost.com/news/drop-dehumanizing-mental-health-assessments-for-trans-youth-wanting-body-altering-hormone-therapy-mcgill-bioethicist-argues

The following is a (currently unsorted) list of sources that I can’t identify if are primary or secondary

• https://www.bmj.com/company/newsroom/pre-treatment-mental-health-assessment-of-trans-people-dehumanising-and-unjustified/

Sources that talk about Ashley’s work in a negative context:

• https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/bioethicist-transgender-children-should-decide-whether-to-transition/ - Editorial, doesn’t mention Ashley by name but does discuss a paper of theirs

Reviews of Ashley’s books:

• https://harvardlawreview.org/print/vol-136/made-to-feel-broken-ending-conversion-practices-and-saving-transgender-lives/
• https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/09685332231193957
• https://www.liebertpub.com/doi/10.1089/lgbt.2022.0111?url_ver=Z39.88-2003&rfr_id=ori%3Arid%3Acrossref.org&rfr_dat=cr_pub++0pubmed
• https://www.canlii.org/en/commentary/doc/2023CanLIIDocs2056
• https://nationalmagazine.ca/en-ca/articles/law/access-to-justice/2022/banning-transgender-conversion-practices

Awards Ashley has received:

• SOGIC - already mentioned in article
• https://www.droit-inc.com/article24225-Une-1ere-auxiliaire-juridique-trans-a-la-Cour-supreme French language article on winning the SOGIC award.
• https://www.law.utoronto.ca/news/florence-ashley-sjd-receives-adel-s-sedra-distinguished-graduate-award 2022 Adel S. Sedra Distinguished Graduate Award
• https://www.law.utoronto.ca/news/doctoral-student-florence-ashley-receives-u-ts-peter-singer-award-in-bioethics 2021 University of Toronto’s Peter Singer Award in Bioethics

Regarding citation by UN independent expert:

• https://www.ohchr.org/en/documents/thematic-reports/ahrc4453-practices-so-called-conversion-therapy-report-independent

Regarding National Assembly testimony:

• https://www.assnat.qc.ca/fr/travaux-parlementaires/commissions/crc-42-1/journal-debats/CRC-201105.html
• https://www.assnat.qc.ca/fr/travaux-parlementaires/commissions/ci-42-2/journal-debats/CI-211202.html

Need to find:

• Secondary sources analysing or citing their work
• Articles about Florence that aren’t interviews of them.

More to add to this as I find it. Sideswipe9th (talk) 17:58, 9 April 2022 (UTC)

My primary concern right now is overuse of WP:PRIMARY sources, via interviews with Ashley. There’s a couple of notability hurdles that need to be addressed before we can consider pushing this draft for review. Accordingly we need to look at WP:NBASIC for general biographical notability, or WP:NACADEMIC for academic notability. I think we’ll have a stronger case for NACADEMIC than NBASIC, given Ashley’s work. Sideswipe9th (talk) 19:00, 9 April 2022 (UTC)

What we really need at the moment are WP:SECONDARY sources. Anything where Ashley’s work has been reviewed, either by their peers or wider audience. Is there any reviews of Ashley’s recent book we can cite? Are there any sources, aside from their University of Toronto profile page that mentions their work being cited by the UN Independent Expert on Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity? Or their legal contributions to the Qubec National Assembly? Sideswipe9th (talk) 19:05, 9 April 2022 (UTC)

I have added links above to the UN report and to the Natioanl Assembly hearings, but they are the official report/transcript rather than a secondary source.

Semi-protected edit request on 17 January 2024

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Change: In 2023, Ashley was one of 21 members appointed to the World Health Organization’s guideline development group concerning the health of trans and gender diverse people.[15]

To: In 2023, Ashley was one of 21 members appointed to the World Health Organization’s Guideline Development Group concerning the health of trans and gender diverse people,[15] but as of January 15, 2024, they was no longer listed as a proposed member of that group.[insert citation below]

Citation: https://cdn.who.int/media/docs/default-source/hq-hiv-hepatitis-and-stis-library/biographies_tgd-gdg_proposed_members_2024.pdf Bert Adan (talk) 12:17, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

 Done with an explanation of why. “They was” changed to “they were” per rest of article. Thriftycat ^{Talk • Contribs} 12:29, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Suggested additions

As I am the subject of the article, it would not be appropriate for me to make edits. I am including information below that I believe would be useful additions to the article.

Florence is a member of the Women’s Legal Education and Action Fund’s Law Program Committee (link) and of the Canadian Civil Liberties Association’s National Council (link).

The book ‘’Banning Transgender Conversion Practices: A Legal and Policy Analysis’’, discussed under ‘personal life and education’, was reviewed in the following outlets:

• https://harvardlawreview.org/print/vol-136/made-to-feel-broken-ending-conversion-practices-and-saving-transgender-lives/ (a “thoughtful, thoroughly researched, and important contribution” to “the project of securing transgender health and respect”; however, it is a Canadian book and “In the United States, for example, many provisions in Ashley’s model law are unlikely to pass constitutional muster.”)

• https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/09685332231193957 (“I cannot emphasize enough how groundbreaking this work is.”)

• https://nationalmagazine.ca/en-ca/articles/law/access-to-justice/2022/banning-transgender-conversion-practices (“You know an author has succeeded when the reader doesn’t realize how easily a book reads despite its complex subject matter.” Describing the book as “nothing short of a rhetorical tour de force” that is “a must-read for jurists, healthcare professionals and policy folks who want to understand this critical issue in a clear, concise, yet thorough manner.”)

Florence’s masters thesis, which formed the basis for the book referenced above, was cited by the UN Independent Expert report on conversion therapy for the proposition that “Practices aimed at changing gender identity include preventing trans young people from transitioning.” See: https://www.ohchr.org/en/documents/thematic-reports/ahrc4453-practices-so-called-conversion-therapy-report-independent

Florence testified before Québec’s National Assembly twice:

• https://www.assnat.qc.ca/fr/travaux-parlementaires/commissions/crc-42-1/journal-debats/CRC-201105.html (testimony by Florence Ashley on the province’s conversion therapy ban; opposition MNA Maccarone, in her discussion with Kristopher Wells, also suggested following the definition of conversion practices offered by Florence Ashley
• https://www.assnat.qc.ca/fr/travaux-parlementaires/commissions/ci-42-2/journal-debats/CI-211202.html (on the province’s controversial Bill 2, which would have separated ‘gender’ and ‘sex’ markers and was decried for outing and misgendering trans people)

Florence was part of an open letter by Alberta law professors to Alberta Premier Danielle Smith raising concerns about her proposed policies on trans youth. See: https://ablawg.ca/2024/02/15/an-open-letter-to-premier-danielle-smith-re-preserving-choice-for-children-and-youth-announcement/

Flowsthatglow (talk) 13:41, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

 Not done for now: Edit requests should be actionable, e.g. "Please add [Example sentence with source] to the end of section three". If you just meant to add some sources that other editors could consider adding to the article, you can add them to the talk page with using the COI edit template. Rusalkii (talk) 05:23, 15 August 2024 (UTC)

Picture

A picture of the subject of the article is now available on Wikimedia Commons and could be added to the page: https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File%3AFlorence_Ashley_Zone_Franche.jpg&oldid=prev&diff=889355837 Flowsthatglow (talk) 18:20, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Hello Flowsthatglows! I'm happy to add File:Florence Ashley Zone Franche.jpg or a cropped portrait version to the article. Before doing so I would like to be sure that it's available under an acceptable free content license. Because of the language gap, I can't see anything at the source to verify that the image is CC-BY 4.0. If you know for sure that Télé-Québec released the photo under this license, could you point to that information? Otherwise it may need to be removed from Wikimedia Commons; images from TV shows (even public broadcast shows) are presumed to be copyrighted, so the image might not be useable here.

If it's more convenient, you could also upload your own photo which you yourself hold the copyright to (e.g. a selfie). –RoxySaunders 🏳️‍⚧️ (💬 • 📝) 03:04, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

 Done A discussion of the image's license status now exists at c:Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Florence_Ashley_Zone_Franche.jpg. Until that's resolved (hopefully by an administrator or volunteer more competent than myself at Commons' processes), I've gone ahead and added the image to the article. –RoxySaunders 🏳️‍⚧️ (💬 • 📝) 03:33, 29 June 2024 (UTC)

I’ve replied to the delete request discussion and sent a PDF of the email thread confirming license status to [email protected]. Long story short, I have written confirmation by the Director of operations of the company who owns the image that its license is CC BY-SA and meets the free content license criteria. Flowsthatglow (talk) 03:31, 30 June 2024 (UTC)