Talk:Chinese Communist Party
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Communist Party of China (CPC)
[edit]The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
I think that Wikipedia should use the official name of the party, even if you disagree with its policies, instead of using an American colloquial or slang term as the official page title as well as in the article itself. This is standard procedure for any party in the world, so why not here? -- Alexey Topol (talk) 14:41, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
- I’m sympathetic but this discussion recurs frequently so it’s best to review the talk page. CCP-proponents place great weight on the common name policies. Others observe that CPC is also common and has the advantage of being as you say official. I also point to WP:GLOBAL as helpful in thinking about this topic. The page had the correct title quite a few years ago, and the trend has been that the consensus towards correcting the page title is improving over time. Nonetheless, we are probably not due for another discussion on this point for some time. JArthur1984 (talk) 14:59, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
- 1) This isn't a nickname, colloquialism, or slang term. This is a translation. It simply uses a slightly different formulation than what the party does in its own materials. There is no substantive difference between "Chinese _____" and "_____ of China".
- 2) Standard procedure for any party in the world? Really? So explain why we call the Danish party Green Left instead of Socialist People's Party? Or why we call the Japanese party Free Education For All instead of Party to Realize Free Education? What is actually done for any party in the world is use the name that English speakers most often use for a party.
- 3) I think WP:USEENGLISH would be more relevant here.
- 4) "Correct" is POV. And since the article was moved and has not been moved back, would seem to be contrary to fact. The article is where it should be by WP's rules. Your idea of "correct" seems to be "whatever the party says". Sorry, but their opinion is irrelevant.
- 5) I have seen no such trend. What I have seen is an increasing number of Chinese citizens who seem to have a problem with the idea that WP is not subject to control by their government. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 14:58, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
- You are of course welcomed to disagree on the basis of policy, but please refrain from remarks on the nationality of those you disagree with. It is non-productive and editors could quite reasonably take offense. JArthur1984 (talk) 15:07, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
- I am simply reporting the nationality that many of those asking for this move have reported for themselves. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 15:14, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
- You are of course welcomed to disagree on the basis of policy, but please refrain from remarks on the nationality of those you disagree with. It is non-productive and editors could quite reasonably take offense. JArthur1984 (talk) 15:07, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
Why does the English-speaking world's translation of Communist Party of China supersede the Chinese translation?
[edit]The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The official website of the CPC translates it as CPC, not as CCP. Source : https://www.idcpc.gov.cn/english2023/zlbjj/bzzc/
Why does the English speaking world's translation supersede the Chinese one? Remember this is not some google translate or AI translation, this is the literal CPC calling itself CPC in its official English language website designed to be shown to the English speaking world.
Why does it matter if 100 million English speakers wrote 100 million articles in 100 million reliable and trustworthy magazines, newspapers, scientific papers and books, that can be used as 100 million sources to be linked in Wikipedia, when the actual CPC itself considers it wrong?
Why do the people who AREN'T part of a thing the sole decision makers in the name of a thing, and the people who are part of a thing not allowed to have their official name for their thing in the English language be the name for the article of the thing that faces the English speaking world in the English version of the wikipedia article of the thing?
Why does "reliable sources" rule apply here, when the problem here is not the reliability of sources or the ubiquity of usage, but the actual CORRECT term to be used?
No one denies how reliably true it is that the vast majority of English speakers call it CCP. The question is, why does the usage of the majority automatically make it the correct title?
The marijuana article is called Cannabis, because the majority of sources are scientific sources. Why doesnt non scientific sources like newspaper articles or books matter there?
Trans people article have their preferred name and pronouns because the sources are mainstream media. Why are sources of mainstream media quoting transphobes (who number in the millions and use deadnames and original pronouns) not matter when it comes to the article name and pronouns?
Why are sources used selectively? Why are Chinese sources translated to English using translation software, or Chinese sources in English translated by the source itself, not "reliable"?
Also, how "unbiased" are sources based in countries that openly express hostility to the CPC? Is Chinese state media used as sources in articles about US foreign policy, for example?
Before you respond in an emotional manner, I'm not making a rhetorical argument here. I want the literal answer to all the questions posed above, directly explaining which Wikipedia rules apply to each and the correct argumentation for each.
Thanks. 125.62.204.79 (talk) 21:45, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 2 September 2024
[edit]|answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.Change the name of the article to Communist Party of China. There is no reason to use the incorrect, unofficial name. 62.57.57.235 (talk) 08:21, 2 September 2024 (UTC)
Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit semi-protected}}template. This has been discussed at length already; scroll up. --AntiDionysius (talk) 08:34, 2 September 2024 (UTC)