Talk:Napoleon

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Section sizes

Section size for Napoleon (52 sections) Section name Byte count Section total (Top) 16,412 16,412 Early life 7,322 7,322 Early career 18 18,583 Return to Corsica 2,657 2,657 Siege of Toulon 2,156 2,156 13 Vendémiaire 4,149 4,149 First Italian campaign 4,311 4,311 Egyptian expedition 5,292 5,292 Ruler of France 395 57,159 18 Brumaire 1,505 1,505 French Consulate 5,315 10,170 Temporary peace in Europe 4,855 4,855 French Empire 334 39,044 Bonaparte becomes Napoleon I 3,408 3,408 War of the Third Coalition 6,401 6,401 Middle-Eastern alliances 1,730 1,730 War of the Fourth Coalition and Tilsit 5,113 5,113 Peninsular War and Erfurt 5,436 5,436 War of the Fifth Coalition 3,362 3,362 Consolidation of the Empire 1,819 1,819 Invasion of Russia 5,059 5,059 War of the Sixth Coalition 6,382 6,382 Exile to Elba 1,988 1,988 Hundred Days 4,057 4,057 Exile on Saint Helena 7,509 11,436 Death 3,927 3,927 Religion 224 8,179 Religious beliefs 3,301 3,301 Concordat 2,089 2,089 Arrest of Pope Pius VII 1,045 1,045 Religious emancipation 1,520 1,520 Personality 6,863 6,863 Appearance and image 5,352 5,352 Reforms 1,272 11,508 Administration 2,231 2,231 Napoleonic Code 1,559 1,559 Warfare 3,272 3,272 Education 3,174 3,174 Memory and evaluation 55 15,933 Criticism 5,512 5,512 Propaganda and memory 5,197 5,197 Long-term influence outside France 5,169 5,169 Children 2,162 2,162 Titles 4,218 4,218 Notes 29 29 Citations 32 12,709 Works cited 55 12,677 Biographical studies 5,083 5,083 Historiography and memory 1,205 1,205 Specialty studies 6,334 6,334 Further reading 2,032 2,032 External links 6,308 6,308 Total 186,205 186,205

Infobox

I really think we need to have another conversation about the family members in the infobox. It’d be good to have another talk about it with more editors involved. The “consensus” to remove valuable information from the infobox for no valid reason is being upheld by the same 2 or 3 editors, and those same few revert any edits that go against their “consensus.” I would give a detailed explanation as to why I think the family info removed should be restored but I’ve already done so in my previous conversation in the talk page, which went nowhere. I’m bringing it up again because I believe most editors would agree to restore the info, but perhaps aren’t aware of this discussion or aren’t passionate enough about it to create the conversation, I’m hoping more editors will get involved to change this ridiculous infobox. Kind regards, Robertus Pius (Talk • Contribs) 19:57, 8 March 2024 (UTC)

Is the information covered in other sections of the article, or only in the infobox? Dimadick (talk) 16:53, 9 March 2024 (UTC)

I’m speaking about the removal of Napoleons parents and children from the infobox. Those are key facts of Napoleon that should be included in the infobox. Robertus Pius (Talk • Contribs) 18:15, 9 March 2024 (UTC)

I agree I think it's a bit unreasonable to exclude his parents and progeny from the Infobox, considering Napoleon's quite important for the late Bonaparte dynasty. I agree to to list his children and parents in the infobox. I know that Aemilius Adolphin prefered the minimalist approach, but I agree with Robertus, legend, Векочел, and others that it's quite important for the infobox. 128.62.179.178 (talk) 20:03, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

I’ve given up trying to change the infobox. Hopefully one day another editor will start up the conversation again as this infobox quite frankly, is ridiculous. Robertus Pius (Talk • Contribs) 23:22, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

@Robertus Pius: Consider opening an RfC. The overall appearance of the infobox of such a high profile figure cannot be decided by a handful of users. More insight is indeed required. Keivan.f^Talk 15:44, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

@Keivan.f: I have thought of that. But I’ve never personally opened an Rfc before so I’d prefer another more experienced editor open the Rfc. I’d of course give my input, as I’ve done in many Rfc’s. Kind regards, Robertus Pius (Talk • Contribs) 16:12, 18 July 2024 (UTC)

Battlefield location

battle of ligny 16 June 1815 missing on waterloo campaign map. Napoleon was in command. Trampled12 (talk) 20:51, 21 April 2024 (UTC)

Change to lead

Hello all

I have changed the the following sentence in the lead: "Napoleon brought modernizing reforms to France and Western Europe, stimulating the development of nation states."To: Napoleon brought modernizing reforms to France and Western Europe, and the upheavals of the period stimulated the development of nation states." It wasn't the modernising reforms in themselves that stimulated the development of the nation states, it was a much more complicated amalgam of revolutionary ideas, the unintended consequences of his reoganisation of Europe and a result of his enemies using patriotism as a weapon of war against him. The last thing Napoleon wanted was a unified Germany on his border, an independent Italy, and a Battle of the Nations.

Happy to discuss Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 22:21, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

A-Class

If this article is a DGA, shouldn’t it go from A-class to B-class? 48JCL ^(talk) 18:14, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

because the A-class criteria is stricter than ga-class 48JCL ^(talk) 18:15, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

If this article was downgraded from GA it should be B class. Cinderella157 (talk) 23:01, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

@Cinderella157 wdym? 48JCL ^(talk) 23:11, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

If this article is a DGA, it goes from A-class to B-class (unless the reassessment indicates it is not sufficient to meet B class). If it is no longer GA, it can no longer be A. I have made the adjustments in the banner to reflect B class. Cinderella157 (talk) 23:17, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

Ohhh thanks a lot! 48JCL ^(talk) 23:19, 29 May 2024 (UTC)

Recent rewrite of lead

Hello all

A couple of editors have extensively rewritten the lead, adding quite a lot of detail. I think it is generally better written than the previous version, but it tries to cram in too much detail and too many links leading to an almost unreadable sea of blue. I have cut some of the detail but I think it should be condensed much more in order to make it a high level summary of the main points of the article, rather than an attempt to rewrite the entire article in four paragraphs.

Happy to dicuss Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 06:05, 11 June 2024 (UTC)

sfn style

The article previously used a roughly 50-50 mix of {{sfn}} and {{sfnp}}. I have standardised the sfns on the latter following personal preference but have no objection changing them all to the former if there's a consensus for that instead – I just think that the style should be the same throughout. There are also one or two plain-text (non-templated) references to convert, which I will do shortly. Best, Wham2001 (talk) 20:28, 11 June 2024 (UTC)

Done, but inevitably some of the sources are missing. If anybody can work out what the following sfns refer to:

• Ref #270, Chandler (1995)
• Ref #419, O'Connor (2003)
• Ref #428, Flynn (2001)

please add the corresponding long-form source information to the bibliography (or fix the sfn, as appropriate). Thanks! Wham2001 (talk) 20:38, 11 June 2024 (UTC)

Napoleon's Height

There's been a myth that Napoleon's height was somewhere around 5'2, but in reality, he was just short of 5'6. Should we include that? Guythatupdatesrandomly (talk) 00:49, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

This discussed in the section on "Appearance and Image". Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 00:52, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Lapérouse expedition

Just stumbled across the detail on the Lapérouse page that Napoleon came close to being offered a place on this expedition, which was lost in 1788, and would've had an immeasurable impact on the course of history if he had been gone with it.

This seems worth noting on his page too! The start of the 'Early career' section skips from his 1785 graduation to 1789 in one sentence, a single sentence detailing this near miss would be a valuable addition. 2601:445:800:13F0:69A4:15C2:A62A:606A (talk) 06:50, 6 July 2024 (UTC)

This is already a very long article in which many details have to be omitted. Napoleon wasn't offerred a position on the La Perouse expedition. Unfortunately, we don't have the space to record events that didn't happen. Aemilius Adolphin (talk) 07:04, 6 July 2024 (UTC)