May 8, 2008
"Seinfeld": So Over or So Timeless?
Forget the debate over whether Clinton should drop out; there’s a more divisive argument going on at Newsweek, where two critics are locking horns over whether “Seinfeld” (the TV series, not the car-crashing Bee Movie star) is still funny after all these years.
The series went off the air ten years ago this month and reruns are broadcast on 200 stations nationwide. “Seinfeld” advocate David Noonan argues that the show’s enduring success is largely owed to the supporting cast: “No sitcom in the history of television has featured a more talented or memorable bunch of second, third and fourth bananas than ‘Seinfeld.’ Period.”
He’s talking about Frank and Estelle Costanza, J. Peterman, Uncle Leo, Morty and Helen Seinfeld, and, of course, Newman. And perhaps the greatest proof of "Seinfeld's" resiliency is that isolated lines from the show can still amuse: Tippy-toes! Mr. Marbles? My wallet’s gone! Levels. The Place to Be! Man hands. Kramerica Industries.
Marc Peyser, on the other hand, says the show doesn’t hold up, and his argument is a tad askew. Among other things, Peyser blames “the laugh track” (huh?), and the characters’ lack of “depth.” But Larry David’s “no hugging, no learning” approach to sitcoms gleefully acknowledged the genre’s inherent shallowness and replaced sentiment with absurdity and farce.
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this show was never funny. ever.
I hated that show when it was on and I still do for the most part today, but I gotta say the few times I tend to be by the TV and I see parts of it...George and Kramer are some funny motherfuckers.
I can't stand Jerry Seinfeld though. What an unfunny twat.
Seinfeld the show was generally quite funny. Peyser totally missed the boat when he said that the characters need to "grow" in order for them and the show to be endearing. I think it's the situations surrounding the characters and how they react to them are what made the show funny.
Yes Seinfeld is timeless, the key is that it doesn't include any time specific humor - few sitcoms could say this.
It shall join the Odd Couple as one of the few timeless classics that are hilarious years later
the only dated aspect of the Odd Couple is the clothes and stage design (70s decor) -
the same will be said of Seinfeld in 30 years
Seriously, it's totally situational. If the characters did anything besides loudly and humorously react, it'd be just another stupid show.
I much fear serious trouble in the fuselage, Frederick.
i never really liked seinfeld at the time, or at least i thought it was somewhat overrated. now that i live in new york, i have a new appreciation for some of the humor and jokes and i like it a lot better.
Seinfeld ended TEN YEARS ago? What the hell? Jesus Christ, how old am I?
spiritross is right on in post #4. Seinfeld is among the best TV shows of all time, not just sitcoms. The show holds up perfectly. Repeated viewing doesn't dilute the product, it actually makes it better. The primary characters are great (Elaine might be the most underrated of them all), the secondary characters are pure classics (Frank Costanza), and the tertiary characters are hysterical (Mr. Kruger, Tim Whatley, etc...)
"The Subway" episode can still bring me to tears.
This show was (and remains) genius.
best secondary, tertiary character - David Puddy (putty?, puddie?) hands down.
i love the car dealership episode. "high five!"
I was laughing hysterically at "The Soup" episode last night.
Can an argument be "askew?" Isn't that an adjective reserved for physical objects like ties and hats?
Laugh tracks suck, but they're basically industry standard. Hard to hold it against the show.
arrested development is king!
Nativist [1], everyone's entitled to their own opinion, and yours is horrible.
Over? People are still quoting terms from the show. I saw somebody mention Festivus on a forum just yesterday. Does anyone even mention the Cosby Show anymore? Even more recent shows like Frasier and Friends have been more or less forgotten. But not Seinfeld. I haven't watched it in years, but I think I'd still laugh if I channel-surfed onto it.
I have a cat named Lloyd Braun. Enough said.
lmao @ Lloyd Braum. He and Joe Davola are friends of Larry David. That show is legendary..
Starts putting me to sleep better than Ambien cr
then to Letterman which really does the trick.
Well thats about it when you are still working
at age 75 .
I wish I had not seen every episode at least three times then maybe it would be timeless if I had not.
@ Spiritof76 - I mentioned Festivus on a forum yesterday, do I know you?
The best shows are actually great radio: turn away from the screen and just listen...the dialog gets you there and it's even funnier. By this measure, Seinfeld is way up there. Frasier is the gold standard. Even if it annoys you, you can't help laughing. that's great television.
I like watching it and trying to pick out which jokes are Larry David jokes and which jokes are Seinfelds...basically which ones are funny and which ones make me want to feed seinfeld glass.
It makes me cringe now (esp. Seinfeld himself - what a dud). But my 83-year-old father watches it over and over, and compares various life experiences to 'Seifeld' episodes. More cringing.
And no, one can *never* compare it to 'The Odd Couple.' Garry Marshall, Lowell Ganz, et al. wrote a show that was head and shoulders above anything that Larry David ever shat out.
I can't believe it's 17 years since:
Well, let me tell you something, funny boy. Y'know that little stamp, the one that says "New York Public Library"? Well that may not mean anything to you, but that means a lot to me. One whole hell of a lot. Sure, go ahead, laugh if you want to. I've seen your type before: Flashy, making the scene, flaunting convention. Yeah, I know what you're thinking. What's this guy making such a big stink about old library books? Well, let me give you a hint, junior. Maybe we can live without libraries, people like you and me. Maybe. Sure, we're too old to change the world, but what about that kid, sitting down, opening a book, right now, in a branch at the local library and finding drawings of pee-pees and wee-wees on the Cat in the Hat and the Five Chinese Brothers? Doesn't HE deserve better? Look. If you think this is about overdue fines and missing books, you'd better think again. This is about that kid's right to read a book without getting his mind warped! Or: maybe that turns you on, Seinfeld; maybe that's how y'get your kicks. You and your good-time buddies. Well I got a flash for ya, joy-boy: Party time is over. Y'got seven days, Seinfeld. That is one week!
www.forgotten-ny.com
These pretzels are making me thirsty!
One of the blessings of aging is the ability to watch each Seinfeld as if it is the first time.
I DVR it every day, when I watch them my wife usually leaves the room because I laugh too loud.
What makes it great is the chemistry of the four stars and the genius of the casting.
A few others come to mind, but they weren't as consistent: Raymond and Mary Tyler Moore (the one with Ed Asner).
Interestingly enough the Seinfeld cast had a rough time after the series ended. Jerry isn't as funny onstage as he was on the show. Julia Louis-Dreyfus needed 2 shots at shows to get going and I'm not crazy about the current one. Jason Alexander (a good actor) didn't make it yet and Michael Richards (probably the most talented) self-destructed.
Maybe they'll do a reunion show some day and we can see how they matured.
You know, if you take away the script and the supporting cast, and the New York references and Larry David's input, and if you forget that 80 million people watched it when it was on and that the DVD's still sell like hotcakes, and that the syndicated episodes still kill in the ratings, then Jerry just isn't funny.
Geez, who do Gothamist commenters hate more, black people or Jerry Seinfeld?
this show has always sucked. the fatso on it was good for his voice for duckman, but the other big noses really reeked.
Yes, the show is classic. Yes, it is on tv 3 times a day every day of the week. Yes, only your parents still watch it or think it's funny. No, Jerry Seinfeld is NOT funny outside of that show. No, I never want to watch another Seinfeld episode again. Man, I really hate Jerry Seinfeld...
"flashy... making the scene... well, I got a news flash for you, joyboy..."
Thanks Kevin for cracking me up at work. Ah, memories...
i still watch it every night...at least once. and, i still laugh out loud. the Lloyd Braun post was hilarious.
The fact that we're still heatedly discussing the show's impact tell you something...it's only gotten more relevant over time. (No one still discusses the impact of "Home Improvement," which used to dominate it in ratings.) Witness the mainstreaming of Festivus, for example! Of course it relied on many things to make it a success (Larry David's perspective, the cast, great secondary characters, Jerry's love of language), but ALL successful undertakings have a lot of things go right for them. I still watch the reruns, though I prefer the DVD episodes since they're uncut for syndication.
kevin walsh: props for transcribing one of the best scenes ever!
you actually inspired me to register after lurking for years.
Seinfeld is hands down one of the funniest sitcoms in the history of television.
Interestingly though, a friend of mine and I had this debate recently and I have to admit the show is a little more dated (and only recently for me) than I ever thought it would get. I think its the clothing style for Jerry which screams "the '90s".
Additionally, my friend made a funny note about how most - not all -of the storylines really only work in that pre-cell phone, less-technologically-advanced era we are currently in.
How did Jerry Stiller never win an Emmy!?
When I got back from France after fifteen years, I had to dutifully watch every single episode of Seinfeld in order to know what everyone was referring to in their little "cultural" jokes.
While it was funny the first time around, the repeats are kind of tired. Humor has evolved. Seinfeld seems like the realm of my aging parents now. My father talks about things Constanza did as if he were one of my cousins or something. It's his only cultural reference. Kind of sad.