Of Emperors and Sky Gods

OF EMPERORS AND SKY GODS

Part 1 describes who the Sky Gods were.

Part 2 (this thread) describes what the Sky Gods flew.

Part 3 describes what the Sky Gods did.

Topic started on 21-10-2009 @ 06:31 AM by Skyfloating

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Part 1 of a 3 part Series

Writing and Research 2009 by Skyfloating for ATS

Ancient accounts around the world speak – almost without exception – of

“Sky People” and “Sky Gods” descending to planet earth, flying through
the skies, coming from and returning to the stars. Many accounts even
specifically name the stars from which those “Gods” travelled to earth
(Native Hawaiian legends for example claiming we are descendant from
“Sky Gods” who came from the Pleiades). It is from such worldwide
concordance that the “Ancient Astronaut Theory” arose. The theory is still
rejected by large parts of global society because it puts most of our belief-
systems to question. This article will focus on the Asian and especially
Chinese aspects about which not much has been published yet.

“The Three Sovereigns” of Ancient China

The officially recognized and recorded History of China begins with the
Shang-Dynasty (1600 – 1046) and somewhat with its predecessor the Xia
Dynasty (2100-1600 BC).

Of what happened before “little is known”, so they say. The truth is that
much of what is recorded as prehistory is viewed as fiction in modern
China. Stripped of its lore, nothing much than some pottery from the
Neolithic Age remains. But if we include the older oral records of Chinese
Prehistory we soon have odd looking Gods descending from the sky,
advanced technology and spaceflight.

The Shang-Dynasty is viewed as entirely historical and the Xia Dynasty as

“partially historical, partially mythological”. This means that Historians will
accept the evidence that matches their dogma and reject the evidence that
does not. Most Historians view everything prior to the Shang-time a myth.
But considering that Chinese Language and Culture were already fully
developed by 2000 BC, something must have been happening before it,
others argue.

The “Mythological Times” pre-Xia-Dynasty are called “The Age of the

Five Rulers” or “The Age of the Three Sovereigns and Five Emperors”
which adds three earlier, even more mythological rulers to the mix.
Researchers that do advocate earlier Dynasties say these 7 rulers reigned
from 2852 to 2205. Others speculate that the mythological lineage refers to
time-spans of ten-thousands of years.

Chinese scholars admit that “Emperors” is a mistranslation. The word

“Emperor” would not be used for another few thousand years. Historians
and Linguists agree that the most likely translation of this character…

...is not “Emperor” but “Half-God” or “Superhuman”.

It is important to know that lineages of Gods, Half Gods and finally humans
are recorded in many other cultures of our World, the best example being
Ancient Egyptian God-to-Half-God-to-King progressions. And just like in
our western culture most Chinese begin their History Lessons at a time
when humans ruled, disregarding the time Gods roamed the Earth as "a
legend only".
The first of the “three sovereigns” is known as the “Heavenly Sovereign”
Fu Xi. The word “Heavenly” is a religious imposition which is, in most
Languages alternatively translated as “Sky”, which gives us the translation
“Sky God” or quite literally “Superhuman of the Sky” as the first ruler-God
of China.

I will be using the translation “Sky” instead of “Heaven” throughout this

article for the following reasons:

1. Most surrounding Asian cultures use the word “Sky” literally when
referring to equivalent Gods and Stories.
2. The Chinese already have other words for “Heaven” or the Taoist
concepts of afterlife and Infinity. In Taoism and Buddhism there is no
Christian concept of “Heaven” and a personalized God, but rather of an
impersonal “source” or “vastness” from which all things arose.
3. What Christians translated as “divine heavenly Beings” are beings that
have rather human traits. They can indeed be seeing flying our earthly skies
rather than an invisible celestial abode. Actually, saying “sky” where sky is
meant and “heaven” were the afterlife or metaphysical realms are meant
gives several mythological accounts a clarity and logic they did not have
before.

Fu Xi is a cultural hero said to have brought writing, fishing and the I-

Ching to civilization, among other things. The wife of Xu Fi, Nuwa is
called the “Earthly Sovereign” or “Earth Goddess”.

Mythology reports of a great flood that swept earth leaving only Fu Xi and
his wife Nuwa to survive. They had fled to the Kunlun Mountains (Tibet)
and there ask for a sign from the “Sky Lords”. The “Sky Lords” approved
of them procreating to found a new civilization. In order to speed up the
procreation or creation of humans they found a way to use "clay" to create
human figures and by some miraculous process could make these clay
figures come alive. Fu Xi ruled over his descendants for 115 years and lived
for 197 years. (1)

Nuwa is credited with having repaired or mended “The Wall of the

Heavens” in order to stop the floods. Two Gods, Gong Gong and Xiang
Yao are said to have caused the flood. It is said that Gong Gong was
ashamed that he lost a fight for the throne of Heaven and in rage he caused
“the sky to tilt towards the northwest and the earth to shift to the southeast
thereby creating the tilt of the earth". This sounds as if dislodging the
earth from its regular axis caused the great floods.

Image: Fu Xi and Nuwa

Both Fu Xi and Nuwa are shown as half-Dragons or half-Snakes in various

ancient depictions.

This story reminds us of many other “mythological” stories of a global

flood, especially the biblical/sumerian one. The the story of earth having
been tilt to cause floods is also found in some legends of Native America.
And for those who think it sounds strange that clay played any role in the
creation of humans, some scientists are in fact discovering the role of clay
in the origins of life:

”Clay had already proved to be potentially important in the origin of life. In

the 1990s biochemist James Ferris of Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
showed that montmorillonite can help create RNA. When he poured
nucleotides onto the surface of the clay, the montmorillonite grabbed the
compounds, and neighboring nucleotides fused together. Over time, as
many as 50 nucleotides joined together spontaneously into a single RNA
molecule. The RNA world might have been born in clay, Ferris argued,
perhaps the clay that coated the ocean floor around hydrothermal
vents.“The thing that’s interesting is that there’s this one mineral that can
get RNA precursors to assemble into RNA and membrane precursors to
assemble into membranes,” (2)

Shennong is the third or first (depending on history version) of the “Three

Sovereigns”, also called “The Human Emperor” or “God of Humans”. He is
described as a God-Farmer who taught people agriculture, cultivating
grains, herbal medicine, making Tea. Some sources say he was the co-
founder of Chinese Civilization, the ancestor of all Chinese along with “The
Yellow Emperor” Huang-Di (the first of the five Emperors) Some say he
was directly related to Huang-Di. Legend says he could make his body
transparent.

What came before the Three Sovereigns is the “Jade Emperor”. The Jade
Emperor is the only of the “Gods” who may have been a non-physical
entity. Taoism says he rules “all realms of existence” for Billions of years.
Because of his metaphysical attributes we will not include him in our
considerations of physically incarnate Extraterrestrials.

The Mythological Emperors of Ancient China

The five emperors or “God-kings” that came after the “Three Sovereigns”
were, in this order:

• The Yellow Emperor (Huang-Di)

• Zhuanxu
• Ku
• Yao
• Shun

Some souces include Emperor Shaohao instead of or in addition to the

Yellow Emperor. We will have a close look at both.

Huang-Di (2697-2598 B.C.) is considered to be the first emperor of China

and the ancestor of all Chinese. Chinese scholars have always argued
whether Huang-Di was “real” or “mythical”. Depending on the source you
can either read that he was a god-king, a mythical-king, a real king, a god-
like-king, a “son of the heavens” or a half-god. I would like to suggest that
the solution may lie somewhere in between: He was real but not human. We
know from other ancient cultures that those kings and rulers that descended
from the skies were referred to as “Gods” and their offspring (from relations
to humans) as “half-gods”. Chinese accounts are no different in this respect.
According to legend, before Huang-Di was born there was “a radiance from
the great star Chi and the Dipper Constellation (Ursa Major)”. His
conception was marked by a “thunderclap on a clear day in the skies”.
Huang-Di then begins his unification of China and is also credited with
being a culture-hero, having brought traditional Chinese Medicine
(including acupuncture) to the country. His wife taught the Chinese how to
make silk. He was said to live in the Kunlun-Mountains in the heart of
Tibet. After he lived and ruled for over 100 years he is said to have
prepared his “return to the skies”. Then a Dragon “descended from the sky
and took Huang-Di away”. Some sources say that he did not die then but
lived another 200 years in the Syuan Yuan stars (the Leo Constellation).
Huang-Di is also said to have authored a book

called “Bai Ze Tu” which describes 11520 types of “shapeshifters,

monsters, spirits, beings” in the Universe. This book is considered lost. A
book of his that was not lost is titled “Handbook on Sex” and is the oldest
known book on Sex. Some sources also cite Huang-Di as having instructed
Lao Tzu…the originator of Taoism.

Many ancient accounts on Huang-Di keep referring to him as an inventor or

developer of odd mechanical devices. A machine called “the south pointing
chariot” helped him win various battles. Another odd device which Huang-
Di is supposed to have invented is what is translated as “a tripod”. This
“tripod” was 4 meters in height and “100s of energies filled its inside” and
made “odd noises”. According to legend this tripod depicted “dragons
flying in the clouds”. Furthermore, the tripod was set up at the “Summit
Lake Mountain” (one of Chinas most famous mountains because of this
legend) and “had to be pointed at the Syuan Yuan star” (our name for the
brightest star in this Constellation is Regulus). This is also the star Huang-
Di is said to be from. Apparently this “tripod” was also able to store data, as
they say it recorded the life and times of Huang-Di. Huang-Di’s “Dragon”
is not described as some mythological creature but as a device to ascend to
“the suns”, as a means of transportation and that this dragon is more than
three thousand years old.

The Biography of Huang-Di states that the Changhuan (this was the name
of his Dragon) covers an extreme distance in only one day and that a human
who “rides” it can reach and age of two thousand years. This is quite
consistent with many other global myths and religious accounts of time
dilation in regards to the “vehicles of the Gods” (3).
A Terracotta Figure of Huang-Di, 210 BC

Some Sources say Shaohao is the rightful father of China. He is also known
as Jin Tian. The Encyclopedia has this to say about him:

Legend says that his mother, a weaver goddess, was a beautiful fairy
named Huange who fell in love with the planet Venus while drifting on
the Milky Way.

Could there be a more blatant reference to spaceflight than this? What this
says is that ShaoHaos mother was travelling through space and came upon
the Planet Venus to which she took a liking.
I looked through my textbook on Chinese Mythology to find confirmation
of this. The full story says that she started out in her “celestial palace”. She
got tired of her work and took a “raft” out into the “deep of the night”,
flying through the “silver river” (which sinologists translate as “The Milky
Way”). She fell in love with the Jin Xing and it is said that “Jin Xing gave
birth to ShaoHao”. Jin Xing is translated as “The Planet Venus”. His
beautiful mothers further travels took her to the moon and finally to earth.
Another part of the myth says that ShaoHaos beautiful mother also wanted
to eat a fruit from a “mulberry tree” and that this fruit would allow her to
live forever (notice the similarities to the Genesis) (3).

ShaoHao himself is not associated with Dragons but with “The White God”,
some accounts saying he is that God, others saying he is the Grandson of
that God. He is also associated with Vultures, The Phoenix, The Eagle, The
Hawk and other birds (which are traditionally recognized as the enemy of
the Dragon). ShaoHaos Tomb is the only known stone Pyramid in China,
located in Qufu. Is it a coincidence that the builder of Egypts largest
Pyramid is caled Kufu?
ShaoHaos Tomb

Next on the List of the “Five Emperors” is Zhuanxu, the Yellow Emperors
Grandson (some sources cite ShaoHao has the Yellow Emperors son). The
remaining four Emperors do not appear to have extraterrestrial origins but
be earth born. Nevertheless various innovations are attributed to them.
Zhuanxu is said to have inveted the Calendar, Astrology, the exchange of
matriarchal with patriarchal society, the outlawing of shamanism and the
ban of close-kin marriage. He led the Shi clain in an eastward migration for
them to intermarry with the Dongyi clan. He lived for 98 years, 78 of which
he spent ruling.

Ku, Yao and Shun, while introducing further skills to humanity, do not
display any divine or miraculous qualities and will also not be considered as
extraterrestrials.
A deity who does not quite fit into this Chronology but is said to be
something or somewhere between the Jade Emperor and the Three
Sovereins is Tian. There is controversy to whether Tian means “Supreme
Being”, “God” or “Heaven” and whether various interpretations come from
the attempted Christianization of Chinese Mythology or not. Looking at the
ancient oracle script for “Tian” he would not seem to be “the Supreme
Being” or Shang-di (The Jade Emperor - A clue that Shang-Di is truly
metaphysical is that it is never represented in pictures or idols):

Expert sinologist Herrlee Creel:

For three thousand years it has been believed that from time immemorial
all Chinese revered T'ien 天, "Heaven," as the highest deity, and that this
same deity was also known as Ti 帝 or Shang Ti 上帝. But the new
materials that have become available in the present century, and especially
the Shang inscriptions, make it evident that this was not the case. It appears
rather that T'ien is not named at all in the Shang inscriptions, which instead
refer with great frequency to Ti or Shang Ti. T'ien appears only with the
Chou, and was apparently a Chou deity. After the conquest the Chou
considered T'ien to be identical with the Shang deity Ti (or Shang Ti), much
as the Romans identified the Greek Zeus with their Jupiter. (4)

Creel goes on to prove that originally Shang-Di was used to refer to

“Supreme Being” and that over time it was replaced with Tian. He also
shows that Tian may not be “The Supreme Being” but simply refer to
“Gods” (plural) or “a great man” or, again, “God-King”. In addition he
finds out that Tian also referred to “Sky” and even “Sky People”.

The ancient character eventually turned into this:

and has several additional meanings, some of which are:

• Forehead, Cranium
• Celestial Bodies, Stars
• The Sky
• Space
• Gods
• King, Monarch, Elders

There are parallels to Tian in other languages. The Mongolian word

“tengri” means both sky, heavens, Gods and King. The ancient Tibetan
Talen or talyan both mean “sky”. In the Naga culture of Burma and India
the word for sky is “tin”.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by Skyfloating]

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reply posted on 21-10-2009 @ 06:31 AM by Skyfloating

Tibetan Mythology

There is a list of ancient Tibetan rulers consisting of 42 names. But here

again our contemporaries say that some of them are historical and others
fictitious. In the case of the Tibetan lineage they say that the first 26 rulers
are legend, all kings from 27 to 32 were historical and 33 to 42 completely
factual.

Although there is hard evidence that the latter kings ruled exactly as
described in Tibetan Mythology, modern scholars cannot accept that the
older rulers were supposed to have descended from the sky in chariots.
The first “Emperor” of the region later known as Tibet was Nyatri Tsenpo.
“Tsenpo” does not really mean “Emperor” though, but “Son of Gods”. This
founder of Bod (the name of the region before it was called Tibet) is a
descendant of Theurang who, according to the Bön Religion (a shamanic
predecessor of Buddhism) is a "Space Spirit". Nyatri Tsenpo looked
absolutely terrifying and was feared for it: His eyes closing from the bottom
to top rather than top to bottom and his hands webbed. He is said to have
descended from the skies (when the people asked where he is from he
pointed to the sky) and landed on the mountain Yalashangbo. Because the
locals feared him they quickly declared him King. The year of his
enthronement is the first year of the Tibetan Calendar.

The Tibetan Kings were said to remain connected to the celestial abodes or
heavens via a dmu thag which is translated by western scholars as “Sky
cord/rope”. This dmu thag apparently deposited Nyatri Stenpo on earth and
pulled him back up to the skies.

The ancient Buddhist text Mani Bka Bum gives an alternative account of
Tibets origins. According to this account the people are the product of a
union between a monkey and an ogress (a female monster). This at last truly
does sound like fiction – until one learns that the “monkey” is actually
representative of a being called Avalokitesvara and the ogress is actually
representative of the goddess Tara.

Avalokitesvara in Sanskrit is “The Lord who looks in every direction”. The

female Goddess Tara also features in Polynesian mythology where she is
said to have ascended from the sea. The Ancient Druids and Ancient Irish
myths also refer to a Tara as being “a mother goddess”. Ancient finnish
accounts refer to “Tar” as “Women of Wisdom”, some South American
Tribes call their “mother goddess” Tarahumara or derivations of that word.

Korean Mythology

In Korean there is no such thing as “Mythology”. Instead, prehistoric

accounts are simply seolhwa (reports, stories) and these are classified into
three sections:

Shinwa: “Stories of Gods and Spirits” (Shin means “Gods” and hwa means
“words” or “talk”.)

Cheonseol: “Handed Down Stories” (Cheon: means “Transmit” and Seol

“To Speak”)

Mindam: Folk Tales, Tales of Common People (Min means “People” and
“Dam” means “to converse, to talk”)

Western scholars try to tranlaste these three as “myth, legend and folktale”,
but that is just not precise. Shinwa usually refer to “The Gods of the Sky”,
Cheonseol to heroic humans and Mindam to ordinary people. But, much to
the dismay of western scholars, there is no “more true” and “less true”
ascribed to them, which is why they ask:

What then, shall we do? Where do we draw the line? Is mythology in the
Korean context limited to shinhwa, namely the small group of keonguk
shinhwa? Or shall we define mythology in a much broader fashion, thus
including many cheonseol and mindam as well? (5)

But if ancient accounts do not draw that line, why do we need to? Because
“its just not possible that the Sky Gods existed”? Because ancient flight was
not possible? Circular reasoning is a logical fallacy but it runs rampant in
regards to the subject.

Just like in other cultures Korean Creation Lore begins with a state of
nothingness out of which duality arose. Then deities arose. Then Gods
arose. Then humans arose. This transition from metaphysical to physical is
inherent in most creation myths. The appearance of physical beings in
Korean Accounts begins with the “Sky Men” 천인(天人) and “Sky
Women” 천녀(天女) who lived on a celestial fortress named Magoseong.

There were four Heavenly Men guarding each cardinal direction of the
fortress, and they were Cheong-gung 청궁(靑穹), Hwang-gung 황궁(黃穹)
who were children of Gunghwee, and Hukso 흑소(黑巢), Baekso 백소(白
巢)who were children of Sohwee. They in turn married the four Heavenly
Women, and gave birth to twelve children, who would become the ancestors
of the humans. (6)

A separate pre-buddhist origins story of Korea is “The Tale of Ancient

Oseon”. According to this there once lived a God called Hwanin on another
“celestial body”. It has been determined that Hwanin is an alias of Indra, a
God who features prominently all over Asia, especially in Hinduism.
Hwanins son, Hwanung is said to have looked down at earth and shed tears
over the fate of humans. He told his father he desired to rule them so that he
could bring peace and justice to earth. Hwanin allowed him to descend to
the earth and rule. He gave him three assistants (“Heavenly Heirlooms”),
three thousand servants and three lords of wind, rain and clouds to
accompany him.
Hwanung thus descended onto the world. He first arrived at the mountain-
top of Mt. Taebaek and there established a city he called Shinshi 신시(神市
), meaning City of the Gods. Hwanung took care of 360 human affairs,
including agriculture, life, illness, justice, good and evil, etc. (5)

Vietnamese Mythology

This is how the Vietnamese say they came to be: Thousands of years ago in
Linh Nam, there lived a clan chief with superhuman powers. His name was
Kinh Duong. One day he met Long Nu, daughter of the Dragon King Long
Vuong. From their union a son by the name of Sung Lam was born who
succeeded his father as the countries ruler under the name Lac Long Quan
(Dragon Lord of the Country of Lac). All kinds of heroic acts, legends and
tales are ascribed to him.

Just like the Chinese, the Vietnamese also have the “Story of the Milky
Way”, albeit in a slightly altered version. Excerpts:

Once upon a time there lived a very beautiful and charming princess,
named Chuc-Nu. She was one of the many daughters of the King of Heaven.
Chuc-Nu was a very hard-working lady and she was often seen sitting on
the shore of the Silver River to sew clothes for her younger sisters.
One day a young man herded his buffaloes to the river. His name was
Nguu-Lang. He was very handsome. He fell in love with the princess at first
sight, and she loved him, too. The King of Heaven, fully aware of their love,
consented for her daughter to marry Nguu-Lang. But the couple had to
promise to continue their work after their marriage.
They enjoyed being married so much the forgot their promise. The King
became furious and ordered them to separate. Each of them would live on
one side of the river and could only look at each other from across the
river. The King allowed them to meet once a year in the seventh month of
the lunar year. This month is called "The Month of Sudden and Short
Showers". When they meet each other, they usually cry for joy. They cry
even more bitterly when it is time for separation.
That is why it rains torrentially at the beginning of the seventh lunar month
in Vietnam. If you happen to be in the countryside during this month, you do
not expect to find any ravens. They are believed to have flown to the sky to
help carry the bridge across the river for the reunion of Chuc-Nu and
Nguu-Lang and if you look at the sky on clear nights, you may see the Silver
River which looks like a long milky white strip. Therefore, it is called "Ngan
ha" (The Milky Way) . (7)

This is a good example of how a some myths have common roots and are
told in slightly altered versions from country to country. It is obviously the
same story as the Chinese “Milky Way” tale, but with a slightly less
extraterrestrial flavour. Apparently the Planet Venus is missing, and the
“Bufallo Herder” approaching the “Silver River” was was described in
more earthly terms.

Philippine mythology

We find the same basic tales of humankinds origins even if we move a bit
further away from mainland China. People have resided on the Philippines
since at least 30 000 years and it is said they passed down their origins story
since that time.

The Story of Bathala

In the beginning there were three powerful Gods: Bathala, the caretaker of
earth, Ulilang Kaluluwa, a serpent who lived in the clouds, and Galang
Kaluluwa, the winged God. These three gods did not know each other.
The direct translation of Ulilang is “Orphaned”. This is highly interesting as
it reflects other ancient myths of the serpent being orphaned or cast out by
the Gods.

Bathala and Uilang Kaluluwa are said to have been lonely Gods. Bathala
desired to create humans “but the empty earth stopped him from doing so”..
About Ulilang Kululuwa Korean Myth specifically states that he liked to
travel and that planet earth was one of his favourite travel destinations.
Again, this is highly indicative of that “serpent” travelling from planet to
planet and thus being an ET-Traveller.

The two Gods one day met. Ulilang Kaluluwa was displeased that there was
another God rivalling him and challenged Bathala to a fight to determine
who would “rule the realms”. Bathala defeated the serpent-God and burned
the his remains. He later met Galang Kaluluwa and they became true
friends and were happy for many years, until Galang Kaluluwa became ill
and died. Later yet, Bathala decided he was ready and able to create
humans.

Bathala was later worshipped as “the most high” God of the Tagalog People
of the Phillipines, as the creator of the Universe and Humanity. But
according to earlier sources he is not “the Supreme Being”. Some say he
only posed as such. Although the Taglog Language is closely related to
Polynesian, “Bathala” has its origins in the Sanskrit “Battara Guru” and
there, does not mean “Creator of the Universe” (for which Sanskrit has
many other names) but “Great Teacher”. Another hint of him not being the
omnipotent creator people worshipped him as is that he “dwelt in a place in
the sky called Kaluwalhatian (Calualhatian)”. He send out lower classes of
Gods called Anito to deal with humans, himself feeling too exalted to do so.
His name is considered too sacred to pronounce and it was forbidden to
make images of him (a God forbidding humans to make images of him can
be found in many other cultures).

Christian Missionaries arriving in the Phillipines turned Bathala into the

Christian God and the Anitos into saints and angels, while demonizing
others. The Visayans are an ethnic group who are distinct from the Tagalog
and they have other origins myths and Gods. Their highest god is Kan-Laon
who lives in Mount Kanlaon. Their sky god(direct translation) is Kaptan.

The Sky God in other cultures

For the sake of comparison and proving that we are dealing with something
more than mere fiction I would like to take a short look at the Sky Gods in
other cultures around the world.

The “Sky Lord” of the Hindu Rigveda is called Dyusa, which derives from
the Sanskrit root word “Div” “to shine”. “Dyeus” is a derivation of the word
and means “sky father” or “shining father” and could very well be the
origins of the Latin “Deus” (God) and the Greek Zeus and the Slavic Sky-
God “Div”. Dyusas appearance in the sky is associated with bellowing
thunder. In later times he is depicted either as a red bull or a black horse
adorned with pearls – the pearls representing the starks of the milky way.
He is said to have been killed by his son Indra who blasts him out of the sky
to fall to earth and die.

In ancient Rome and Greece the “Sky God” was Jupiter (Zeus in Greece)
and usually depicted as an Eagle or Hawk and associated with flying
through clouds. As I will later show, ancient Asian Mythology hints at a
war between Eagle-Gods and Serpent-Gods.

In Maori Mythology Rangi and Papa are the sky-father and sky-mother
(both males and females feature as sky gods in all ancient accounts). Papas
husband Rangi in Hawaiian is Wakea. In Rarotongan its Atea. In the Cook
Islands the same sky God is called Vatea – which is almost identical to the
Germanic “Vater” from which the English “Father” comes from. Its funny
though that the female goddess is called “Papa”, which most of us associate
with father.

Rangi and Papa are the parents of many children. One of them is
Tumatauenga, who, in a family feud, wants to kill his parents. His brother
Tane disagrees and suggests to separate the parents by having Rangi live in
the sky above while Papa lives on earth below. They attempt to carry out
their plan but despite their efforts Rangi and Papa remain “close together in
their loving embrace”. It is only after further efforts that Tane achieves in
forcing tem apart. One child Tāwhirimātea, disagrees with this and declares
himself an enemy of his brothers. He flies off to join Rangi in the Sky and
there bears his own offspring. He gathers his offspring as his army to fight
his brothers. To conquer them he sends floods, hurricanes, storms over the
earth. He “attacks the oceans and huge waves rise, whirlpools form, and the
Gods dwelling on earth, flee in panic. One of these Gods, Tangaroa, lives in
the ocean. His son Punga has two children, Ikatere, associated with Fish and
Tu-te-wehiwehi, the “ancestor of the serpent”. Terrified by the disasters
Tāwhirimātea is causing, Tangaroa forever remains angry at Tane for giving
refuge to his runaway children. So Tane provides the descendants of
Tumateauenga with boats, fishhooks and nets to catch the descendants of
Tangaroa so that they may survive the flood. Tangaroa retaliates “by
swamping canoes and sweeping away houses, land and trees that are
washed out to sea in floods”.
This “war of the worlds” story goes on for awhile, but this short excerpt
should suffice to show that it is very similar to other accounts that tell of a
war between sky-gods leading to a huge flood.

The most important “sky ruler” of ancient Egypt was Horus who is also
associated with the Hawk, Falcon or Eagle. He is however (correctly in my
opinion) depicted as a humanoid being. “Flying like an Eagle” is a quality
ascribed to him rather than a trait of his body. He is said to be the son of Isis
and Osiris. His name comes from “hr w” which means not only “Falcon”
but also “the distant one”, “the one above”, “the one in the sky”.
Isis told Horus to protect the people of Egypt from Seth, the God of chaos,
storms and floods. Pharaos are said to be Horus “in human form”.
The Mixtec of ancient Mexico are among those who most bluntly trace their
origins to extraterrestrials. The word “Mixtec” itself translates as “place of
the cloud people”. They do not call their forefathers “Gods” or “Deities”
but simply refer to them as “people who came down from the sky”.
The ancient mythology of the Aztecs, also of ancient Mexico, tells the story
of an “Eagle” that killed a “Serpent” a long time ago. The Aztects trace
their origins to the Toltecs who worshipped Quetzalcoatl, a feathered flying
serpent.
I could go on like this, from culture to culture, but this should suffice to
show that we might be mistaken about our ancient History.

What Academics say about “Sky People”

In late nineteenth century opinions on comparative religion, in a line of
thinking that begins with Friedrich Engels and J. J. Bachofen, and which
received major literary promotion in The Golden Bough by Sir James G.
Frazer, it was believed that worship of a sky father was characteristic of
nomadic peoples, and that worship of an earth mother similarly
characterised farming peoples. According to this body of doctrine, nomads
militarily overran farming societies, and replaced goddesses with male
gods. During the process, it was believed that the invaders devalued the
status of women and replaced a matriarchy with a patriarchy. The religious
changes were imagined to reflect this change in the status of the sexes. This
belief system was linked to the discovery of the Indo-European languages,
and it was fancied that the military conquest underlying this model spread
those languages. The sky father was held to be an Indo-European cultural
ideal. (9)

My own objection to this interpretation is that all the myths referring to the
“Sky Gods” feature both Gods and Goddesses, universally. Most often they
are even portrayed as equal. Furthermore, there is really no evidence that
originally farmers worshipped women and nomads worshipped men. My
main objection is that the rise of anti-religious materialism in the 16th to the
19th Century went too far in its renouncements and lost all sense of rational
discernment. Religious concepts were seen as superstition and contrary to
scientific thought and method. As such, the entire idea was rejected instead
of re-interpreted. The ancient astronaut theory, which maintains that the Sky
Gods were neither Supreme Beings to be worshipped, nor imaginary cults
only emerged in our times when we learned that flight and space-travel are
indeed possible and always have been. Only for those who know nothing of
space travel those ancient tales appear like fiction.

The theory of a common sky father is rejected by most archaeologists and

anthropologists as an explanation of early European religious life. The
archaeological record does not indicate that Indo-European languages
spread throughout their area in Europe and Asia by military conquest
alone. Many non-Indo-European cultures also have male-dominated
pantheons, without being conquered or bent on conquest. There is no direct
historical correlation between the worship of goddesses and the social
status of women; nor is there a great deal of evidence that the worship of
female deities is associated with agriculture, or that male gods accompany
nomadism. Nor is there any reason to believe that the Indo-Europeans
practiced a religion that was more male-dominated, patriarchal, or wont to
promote male gods at the expense of goddesses, than any other polytheistic
religion. (9)

Other academics correctly reject the notion of a belief in Sky Gods and
whether they were male or female to have anything to do with nomadism or
agriculture. Unfortunately they also tend to view the myths of various
cultures as “unrelated”. This, in my opinion, is a mistake. The story of
floods coming from a “war between Gods” for example is similar enough
across the globe and warrants more comparative and interdisciplinary study.

This completes Part 1 of a 3 Part Series (2 and 3 to be published at another

date)

Sources:

1 Worshiping the Three Sage Kings and Five Virtuous Emperors - The
Imperial Temple of Emperors of Successive Dynasties in Beijing. Beijing:
Foreign Language Press. 2007. ISBN 978-7-119-04635-8.
2 Carl Zimmer / What came before DNA? (Discovery Magazine Online,
2004).
3 Lihui Yang and Deming An / Handbook of Chinese Mythology
4 wikipedia.org/wiki/Tian
5 pantheon.org/areas/mythology/asia/korean/articles.html
6 wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_folklore
7 vietnam-culture.com/zones-4-1/Myths-and-Legends.aspx
8 wikipedia.org/wiki/Sky_father 9 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sky_father

Of Flying Dragons and Metallic Discs

Most of this information has not been published before - anywhere. It is the result of the authors own research.

This is Part 2 of a Series. Please read Part 1 before reading this as it puts the following
information into Context.

Flying Dragons: Vehicles of the Gods?

After "sky-gods" the second most prominent ingredient of ancient myth are Dragons,
which also feature in every part of the world and most frequently in ancient China.

This section proposes that the Dragons of Mythology are actually aircraft or spaceships
and that our ideas of the red-eyed, fire-breathing fantasy-serpents are misinterpretations
and distortions that have developed over time. As odd as this idea may sound at first, it
becomes more likely when we look at the original descriptions and behaviour of Dragons
and find that they were round flying metallic objects that spit fire rather than menacing
monsters. Metallic because mythological accounts describe them as golden, silver,
bronze, copper, “shiny”. They are also described as glowing in the dark. As flying,
landing and taking off again. And even as going underwater, and transporting various
Beings (“Gods”) in their “bellies” and as those “Gods” landing with them and walking
around. Spitting Fire? Yes. Imagine on of our ancestors seeing one of our jet-planes take
off. How would he describe it? Probably with “it roars like thunder and spits fire”.

Consulting the Internet-Encyclopedia on Dragons I found this Definition:

The dragon is a legendary creature with serpentine or otherwise reptilian traits that
features in the myths of many cultures. The two most familiar interpretations of dragons
are European dragons, derived from various European folk traditions, and the unrelated
Oriental dragons, derived from the Chinese dragon ("long"). (3)

This seemingly simple Definition alone contains several problems. Why, for example, is
the Chinese Dragon "unrelated"“ to the European Dragon? This very item echoes the
attitude of mainstream science that “Serpent Myths have no common roots”. But why
not? Who says so? We know that flying serpents and dragons feature in every ancient
culture. Only to name a few:

Apophis was the giant serpent of ancient Egypt. Azazel is the biblical Dragon. In Avestan
Mythology the serpent is called Azhi Dahaka. Mythical pre-dynastic emperors of ancient
China are called “Dragon Kings””. English folklore refers to Dragons ruling the earth in
very ancient times. Gorynych is the most famous ancient Russian Dragon. In Greek
Mythology we have Hydra, a “Dragon-Like Being”. In Hebrew Scriptures the Dragon
reigning in the waters is called Leviathan. The Aztec Mythology of Ancient America has
a flying serpent called Quetzalcoatl. Japenese Mythology has so many ancient Dragons
they’d be too numerous to list here. Hungarian Mythology calls the Dragon Sarkany.
Tiamat and Apsu from Babylonian Mythology are often considered to be Reptilian. The
ancient Germanic Dragon is the Lindwurm. In Slavic Mythology Zmey Gorynych is the
winged serpent that spits fire. The Aborigines have their Rainbow Serpents.

The list of Serpents from every culture and country goes into the thousands, yet
conventional “wisdom” maintains that they are unrelated and fictitious. Carl Sagan for
example, one of the most popular advocates of natural sciences in the 20th Century had
this to say in his book “Dragons of Eden” (1977):

“The Myth of Dragons arose from the innate fear of reptiles that we share with other
mammals”

This sentence displays a certain amount of arrogance in that it wipes thousands and
thousands of pages of ancient tradition away as meaningless.

Did Dragons originally look like discs?

I made an odd discovery while looking into the topic. And that is, that according to some
Chinese Academics, “Dragons” were originally not depicted as stylized snakes but as
coil-shaped or disc-shaped.

One such early form was the pig dragon. It is a coiled, elongated creature with a head
resembling a boar. The character for "dragon" in the earliest Chinese writing has a
similar coiled form, as do later jade dragon amulets from the Shang period. (3)

According to this view, the predecessors of the Dragon are called Zhulong or “Pig-
Dragon” which seems like a rather unfortunate label in my opinion because it appears to
be based on our own modern-day prejudice of them being “Dragons” in the first place.
According to the Chinese this “coil shape later opened-up to become the shape of a
snake”. This “Dragon” is shown in thousands of ancient artefacts and is sold in our times
as a jade embellishment. This is a jade artefact showing such a “Pig-Dragon”:
According to conventional wisdom...

...“The character for "dragon" in the earliest Chinese writing has a similar coiled form”
and “Early pig dragons are thick and stubby; later examples have more graceful,
snakelike bodies”. (1)

So the image of a coiled or disc-like object transformed into a “more graceful snakelike
body” over time? Well wouldn’t that be interesting! It would mean that the flying
Dragon originally appeared as a flying Disc! Here are more examples (9) of the ancient
artefact of the Zhulong as the pig-dragon is called in Chinese, the first one being dated to
4000 BCE:
What is most amazing about these original depictions of “Dragons” is that they have
nothing to do with what we were conditioned to believe in Disney-esque movies, games
and cartoons. Imagine them flying vertically for a moment. What do you see?

When I confront Skeptics with the notion of Dragons as misinterpreted flying saucers
they chuckle and scoff: “Those are fictitious myths. Serpent myths were a psychological
reaction to our fear of snakes”. Such comments are ignorant of the fact that the rendering
as snakes seems to have come later.

Apart from “Pig Dragon” there is another Definition for the word Zhulong, which seems
to fit much better to the idea of aircraft:

The keyword in the names Zhuyin and Zhulong is zhu, "torch; candle; shine upon;
illuminate; light up" . (2)

As I’m not familiar enough with the Chinese language it remains a mystery to me how
what may have originally been called “Shining Dragon” turned into “Pig-Dragon”.

And when did those coiled metallic shining discs become green, red-eyed, fire-breathing
monsters? Even the western origins of the word point to something different:

From Greek δράκων (drakōn), "a serpent of huge size, a python, a dragon" and that from
δρακεῖν (drakein) aorist infinitive active of the verb δέρκοµαι (derkomai) "That which
flashes or gleams”". (4)

That which flashes or gleams?. That is quite consistent with the original Chinese
sources. It is also more consistent with descriptions of the Dragons being vehicles of the
Gods rather than the Gods themselves. The writings of the Hindu Mahabarata also often
refer to Nagas (flying serpents) not as Gods themselves but as the Gods “riding” on them.
But why do ancient cultures universally use reptilian creatures to describe what they saw?
Is it because the flying craft were built to look reptilian? Is it because the pilots were of a
reptilian race? Or is that the image those ancient Lords projected in order to deceive or
entertain? I cant answer these question with any certainty. But in this context it is
interesting to look at the ancient Chinese seal script form for “Dragon”:
Nowadays this character is pronounced long in Mandarin Chinese and translated to
“Dragon” in English. The modern character has meanwhile changed to 龍. Looking at the
original character for „Dragon“ though it may just as well be some human or humanoid
being attached to some vaguely aerodynamic device. Automatic associations to snake-
monsters do not come up. Those “scales” on the side could just as easily be jet-nozzles.
Another interesting Encyclopedia entry:

Upon his head he has a thing like a broad eminence (a big lump), called [chimu] (尺木).
If a dragon has no [chimu], he cannot ascend to the sky. (5)

The reason this caught my attention is not only because it seems to indicate some kind of
device or pilot being necessary for flight. The word “Chimu” is also the exact name of a
people said to have founded an ancient Kingdom in Peru (The Kingdom of Chimor). The
Chimu of Peru, are said to be descendants of Dragons (a main temple of theirs being
called “Huaca El Dragon”) and their capital city was called Chan Chan, which actually
sounds rather Chinese. In researching this subject it does pay off to pay attention to
names, words and their meaning.

Lets see what other interesting information we can glean from records that are widely
available in public.

It can fly among the clouds or hide in water (according to the Guanzi). It can form
clouds, can turn into water or fire, can become invisible or glow in the dark (according
to the Shuowen Jiezi). At the end of his reign, the first legendary Emperor Huang Di was
said to have ascended to Heaven with his Dragon. Since the Chinese consider Huang Di
as their ancestor, they sometimes refer to themselves as "the descendants of the dragon".
This legend also contributed towards the use of the Chinese dragon as a symbol of
imperial power.(5)

The Chinese knew many different types of “Dragons”, and the descriptions thereof tend
to resemble a fleet of aircraft rather than a group of fantasy-figures. Lets look at only a
few of the hundreds of “longs”

• Tialong: Literally “Sky Dragon” or “Star Dragon”, a Dragon that pulls chariots of the
Gods and guards places in the sky.
• Shenlong: Literally “God Dragon”.
• Fucalong: Literally “Hidden Treasure Dragon”, associated with flying into Volcanoes
and Underground to hide treasures.
• Dilong: Literally “Earth Dragon” (as opposed to “Sky Dragon”), also associated with
entering rivers, lakes and seas.
• Yinglong: Literally “Communicating or Responding Dragon”
• Panlong: Coiled Dragon
• Jialong: Scaled Dragon
• Huanglong: “Yellow Dragon”, the vehicle of the Emperor
• Feilong: Literally “Flying Dragon”, associated with flying in the sky in through the
Clouds.
• Qinglong: Literally “Azure Dragon” associated with certain “mythological creatures”.
• Qilong: A Dragon sometimes horned, sometimes not horned.
• Longwang: Literally “Dragon Kings”
• Hong: Literally “Rainbow Serpent”
• Teng: A flying Dragon without legs

There are many other types, too numerous to count. Thinking that all of this comes from
“peoples inherent fear of snakes” is a bit of a stretch, no? It seems that all this talk of
Dragons throughout the world is based on an ancient reality, long forgotten. The original
meanings of the words were merely stylized and mythologized.

Other Asian Dragon Myths

For comparative measure, lets take a short look at sanskrit literature. From the
Mahabarata:

In the Mahabarata the enemy of the Nagas (flying serpents, Dragons) is a “gigantic bird”
named Garuda. I put “gigantic bird” in quotes, because just like the Nagas are not
literally snakes, Garuda is not literally a bird. Garuda is a Deva (Demi-God) who uses a
“gigantic bird” as his flying vehicle. Other accounts of Garuda describe say that he
himself is “half Eagle, half Human”. He is also said to be of violent force, speed and
martial skill. Garuda is associated with the star Constellation Aquila (The Latin name for
Eagle). The star constellation was associated with Vulture Volans (flying Vultures) by
the ancient Romans. This is interesting because Buddhist Tradition also has their own
Garuda which they describe as an “extremely predatory giant bird”. Buddhist Mythology
also says Garuda is “well-winged” or has “speedy wings”.

“As a bird” Garuda is said to have a golden body. When he flies he is so big that he
“blocks out the sun”. Although he is said to be the enemy of the serpents, his mothers
sister is said to be “The Mother of Serpents”. One day his mother, Vinata lost a foolish
bet or game to her sister (the serpent) and became enslaved to her. Garuda wished to
release his mother from slavery, approached the serpents and asked them how he could
buy her freedom. They told him he’d have to go to into the “Ocean of Milk” (as the story
involves Garuda flying to the stars, could it be that this was the ancients term for “Milky
Way”?) and bring them amrita, “elixir of immortality”. Amrita at that time was said to be
in the possession of other Gods who guarded it jealously. They had “ringed the elixir with
a massive blazing ring of light that covered the sky” and had “blocked the way to it with
a fierce mechanical contraption of sharp rotating blades”. Despite these precautions
Garuda travelled to the “abode of the Gods in the sky” to steal their treasure. He was met
by Gods in full battle-array. Garuda defeated their army and “scattered them in all
directions”. He then extinguished the “Ring of Fire” with some type of water and passed
through the rotating blades by reducing his size. He then returned to the serpents with the
elixir (and later conspired to regain possession of it).

Only this short trip to Vedic literature shows that the ancients of India knew how to
discern between normal birds and snakes and those vehicles piloted by the “Gods”. Vedic
literature is also full of descriptions of mechanical devices and machinery. It seems that
here the Information was passed down with less filtering than elsewhere.

For the longest time Dragons were worshipped as holy in China. They are still revered
and it is considered a crime to treat depictions of Dragons disrespectfully. Western
Science has placed the entire Mythology into “spiritual” realms with no connection to or
bearing on our physical reality. However, the Dragons or Pilots/Gods of the Dragons
respectively, are described as having entirely human traits and dealing with everyday life.
According to Chinese Mythology they…

• Mated with Humans and produced offspring (“Descendants of the Dragon”)

• Dragons can support heavy weights
• They like music and literature
• They can fly very fast
• They can slaughter their enemies
• Dragons themselves can be very loud and noisy (6,7)

In Vedic literature, the enemy of the serpent is the Eagle. In Chinese Mythology the
serpents greatest adversary is the Tiger – the flying Tiger to be more precise. The Tiger
on which various Gods, Half-Gods and Humans flew to be even more precise. Guru
Rinpoche was said to be flying around Asia rescuing various areas from serpents and
demons and spreading Buddhism throughout the Himalayas. This is noteworthy because
there are several world religions that are said to have been founded in order to battle the
serpent – Christianity being one of them.

Moving forward lets look at some of the Dragon Mythology of the countries surrounding
China. It is safe to assume that their Mythologies have similar origins and may contain a
few more clues.

In Bhutan the word for “Thunder Dragon” is Druk, which is interestingly enough more
related to our word for it than the Chinese “long”. In their own language Bhutan is called
Druk Yul, “Land of the Dragon” and their leaders are called Druk Gyalpo, Dragon Kings.
The reason it is called “Thunder Dragon” is because thunder is “the voice of the Dragon
roaring”.

In Japan the most ancient word for Dragon is Tatsu (which reminds me of an ancient
Germanic word for Dragon “Tatzel-wurm”). Another word is ryū. In ancient Japan
Dragons also fly but more often they are described as descending into water. The first
Emperor of Japan, the Half-God Jimmu is said to descend from Toyotama-hime, a
goddess who was married to the Dragon-God Ryūjin. So here we have yet another
“founder of a country” who is descendant from “Dragons”. Japanese Mythology agrees
that the Dragon is in conflict with the Tiger. The Tatsu is often described as being able to
either shapeshift or disappear.

Korean Dragons are also able to fly but, just like Japanese Dragons, are often described
as ascending into and dwelling in the Oceans. Possibly Dragons are “flying creatures” in
China because the landmass of China does not have many oceans to descend into,
whereas Japan and Korea are surrounded by waters. More often than in other countries,
Korea features Dragons speaking and communicating – both with each other and the
surface dwelling humans. Another interesting difference with Korean Dragons is that
they are often shown to carry an Orb known as Yuh-Ji-Joo. It was said that whoever
owned this Orb was able to “create at will”. This is reminiscent of the wish-fulfilling
Cintamani Pearl of Hindu literature.

Some external Sources used for Section 1:

(1) wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_dragon
(2) wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhuyin_(mythology)
(3) hwikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_dragon
(4) wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon
(5) wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_dragon
(6) Lihui Yang / Handbook of Chinese Mythology
(7) Keith G. Stevens / Chinese Mythological Gods
(8) wikipedia.org/wiki/Garuda
(9) baiyu-quietmuse.blogspot.com/

[edit on 22-10-2009 by Skyfloating]

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Of Ancient Discs and Lost Civilizations

The Bi or Pi Disc 璧 is a circular artefact from ancient China. Its existence can be dated
back to at least 4000 B.C. The oldest Pi-Discs were mostly made of Jade (later discs are
also made of glass). A few samples:
Incised on both sides with stylized birds and dragon heads.
Two inner and one of the edges are banded with a twisted rope pattern.
Probably Late Eastern Zhou Dynasty (circa 770-221 B. C. E.)

Ca. 3100 B.C., found in a Neolithic tomb

A Neolithic artefact on which the green colouring is hardly visible anymore due to
calcification.
This 3000 year old Bi-Disc has an inscription by an 18th Century Emperor who wrongly
identifies it as a cup holder.

The word “bi” is translated as “heaven” or “sky” which gives us the interesting term Sky
Disc. Original Bi-Discs are undecorated and plain. Later ones tended to add shapes,
colours and images to them. We are reminded of the “pig-dragon” which was also
somewhat circular and also began plain and evolved to something more intricate over
time. Some are also reminded of the ancient Egyptian “sun-disc” which was the vehicle
of various Gods.

My interest in the sky discs was sparked by the great variety of expert opinion on their
origin and purpose. Some explain them to be symbols of the ruling elite because it was
members of the ruling class that were buried with the objects and because it was declared
the imperial seal of China symbolizing the receipt of “the mandate of the heavens”.
Others say they represent the solar system or the Universe and are a metaphysical symbol
of oneness. Others explain them as tools of divination used by shamans. I tend to think
they may be all of the above and more. The most accepted theory states that they were
ancient symbols of the sky. But why would the sky be shown as a disc…unless of course
they refer not to the sky but to those godly devices flying in the sky…

A mythological description that really caught my attention was that they were originally
“devices for communicating with the heavens”:

Bi discs were often considered to be “the Ear of Heaven”, and sometimes the hole in the
disc was placed in front of the mouth so that the dead could speak to their ancestors.
(1,3)

Such accounts are the origin of the idea that they are shamanic divination tools. The
question that arises so many times in these studies is whether technological items were
“spiritualized” so that a simple walkie-talkie or phone with which to call up the Gods
became a “mystical divination tool to commune with the dead”.
What is known is that late Neolithic cultures buried the discs beside the dead because the
discs were long associated with ascending to the sky. Placing them beside the dead was
somehow believed to support their ascension – but why? Those buried with the disc were
usually of high social status – hence the theory that only the elite handled them. This
seems to be connected to the belief that only Kings, Rulers and Emperors “ascend to the
sky”. And that belief seems to be based on the older fact that the kings themselves were
“from the sky”.

Interestingly the practice of burying the dead with “ascension discs” is shared with some
cultures of Mesoamerica, adding to the theory of ancient contact between China and the
Americas (4). Another reason they are associated with the ruling elite and the sky is
because Jade has always been connected to people of rank and royalty. There was a time
in China when Jade was considered more valuable than silver or gold. (1). It was called
“the stone of the heavens” and all types of mystical qualities were attributed to it. (1).

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The Dropa Stones Controversy

Much of the information on “ancient astronauts” uncovered here has never made it to the
public. A story that that was widely circulated in literature on UFOs and Mysteries for
decades and also made it to worldwide tabloids is that of the “Dropa Stones” and “Dropa
People” who were allegedly a race of dwarf-sized extraterrestrials who crash landed in
Tibet around 10 000 B.C. I first encountered this story in the book “Return to the Stars”
(1970) by Erich von Daniken. And I later dismissed the entire story as a hoax.

Gordon Creighton, fluent in Mandarin and Russian, and attaché to the British Embassy
in Beijing, and editor of Flying Saucer Review, investigated the Dropa story thoroughly
and found it to be complete fiction.(6)

This was one of the instances I trusted the judgement of Skeptics because none of the
stories aspects could be verified in any way. Or so I believed. Looking at the subject of
ancient discs in general I re-examined the case and discovered that the tale of the Dropa
stones may be fiction but that it cannot be completefiction. For those who are not familiar
with the story yet, we will review some of it as it was told in the Daniken books of the
early 70s.

According to Daniken, the story was relayed to him by the once popular science-fiction
author Alexander Kazantsev. Kazantsev later denies this. It begins with the archaeologist
Chi Pu Tei, from the Chinese Academy of Sciences in Beijing who led an expedition to
the Kunlun Mountains of Tibet in 1937 to 1938 (Side-Note: this would be around the
same time Hitler and his Nazis went to Tibet in search of mystical powers). Looking for
shelter from a storm his team entered a cave in a region called Bayan-Kara-Ula (image &
map):
As is usual with hoaxes none of the sources can actually say where these caves are
supposed to be located. The Baian-Kara-Ula area is at the border of Tibet and the Chinese
province Sichuan. In 2008 Sichuan made headlines for one of the largest earthquakes in
recent History, killing more than 90 000. But it has also been in the headlines for
featuring one of the most significant archaeological discoveries of all times – not only for
China, but for the whole world: An apparently fairly advanced lost civilization that
existed in pre-historic times. More on this soon, for now back to the storyline:
Inside the cave Chi Pu Tei and his team found inscriptions on the walls and several tombs
set up in a row. These tombs contained the skeletons of dwarves who averaged 1.20 cm
in height and had abnormally large heads.

“Dwarves with abnormally large heads” does remind us of the “grey species” of
contemporary UFO-Literature. Skeptics argue that the Dropa-Story was “fixed to
corroborate with the grey-aliens myth”. This cannot be true though. As we will later see,
the dropa story predates the emergence of the “grey alien” by at least more than 2
decades.

Buried along with the dwarves were 716 stone discs each about 30 cm wide and 1.0 cm
deep. These are referred to as the “Dropa Stones”. Each has a hole in the middle just like
the Bi-Disc and each is inscribed with hieroglyphs or symbols of unknown origin.
The story goes that the Chinese Academy of Sciences tried to cover-up the existence of
the Dropa People and their stones but that it eventually trickled out into public. The
stones lay undeciphered in vaults of the Academy of Sciences when in 1962 a Professor
by the name of Tsum Um Nui and his team of the Prehistory department began
deciphering inscriptions so small they had to be viewed with a magnifying glass. They
were transcribed to paper. The Professor claimed that the inscriptions described the crash
of an extraterrestrial spacecraft 12 000 years ago.

“The Dropa came out of the clouds in their aeroplanes. Before sunrise, our men, women
and children hid in the caves ten times. When they finally understood the sign language
of the Dropa, they realised the newcomers had peaceful intentions...”

It is also said that the alien beings would not be able to repair their craft and return to
where they came from and that they were saddened by this.

Tsum Um Nui was soon thereafter forced to abandon his position and returned to his
native Japan where he died one year later. In 1965 Chi Pu Tei and four of his colleagues
were finally given permission to reveal their theory and publish it as "The Grooved Script
concerning Space-ships which, as recorded on the Discs, landed on Earth 12,000 years
ago".
Russian scientists then asked to examine the discs and found that they contained large
amounts of cobalt, iron and nickel. According to a Dr. Vyatcheslav Saizev who described
the examination of the stones in Sputnik magazine, they vibrate or “hum” as if an electric
charge is passing through them. Some claimed that the “hum” was communicating
certain signals like a record player would. This is where they got the name “the talking
stones” from.

A follow-up book by Daniken tells the story of an Austrian Engineer, Ernst Wegerer,
who took a guided tour of the Banpo Museum in Xian in 1974 and claimed to have seen
the Dropa-Stones on display, including their tiny hieroglyphs in partially crumbled spiral
grooves. Wegerer asked the Museum Manager for more information on the pieces but she
knew nothing of them than that they were unimportant “cultic objects”. Wegerer was
allowed to take them into his hand and estimate their weight (around 1 kilogram or 2
pounds) and take photos of them (the photos in this book section are by Wegerer). His
photos do not capture the fine detail of the spiral grooves though.

Skeptics have claimed that none of the people in Danikens story actually exist. In the case
of Wegerer this is certainly not true as Wegerer himself confirms that he does indeed
exist. Searching the Internet you will be able to find photos of him and his discs.

According to a statement of Professor Wang Zhijun the Director of the Banpo-Museum

in March 1994, a few days after Wegerers visit the manager was called away from her
position at the museum without telling her why, and the two stone-discs vanished.

That is the basic outline of the Dropa-Story. At the time of its first publication much of it
was entirely unverifiable. A continuation of the tale then followed in the 1978 book
“Sungods in Exile” by David Agamon. This book describes a 1947 expedition of an
English explorer Dr. Karyl Robin-Evans who said he made contact with the
“Descendants of the Dropa” who at the time comprised of only a few hundred dwarfish
members. The book says that Robin-Evans stayed with them for half a year to learn their
Language and History and that they told him their ancestors come from Sirius.

After this book was published Skeptics really started coming out of the woodwork
pointing out hundreds of inaccuracies and fabrications within the book. They could at last
state, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that the entire Dropa-issue was a hoax.

But: The author himself admitted in a 90s Interview with Fortean Times Magazine that
the book was science-fiction and the character of Robin-Evans invented!

Which begs the question: Was the book purposefully designed to further discredit the
Dropa-Story? This is an official rebuttal of the story by David Richie. It was first
published in various Journals of Skeptics and now circulates around the Internet, my
notes inserted below the paragraphs.

“1. The discovery. There are no mentions of 'Tsum Um Nui' anywhere; as he is supposed
to have fled China and died in Japan in the 1960s this cannot be negated by Cultural
Revolution, Communist coverup theory. Also, there is no mention of the 1938
archaeological expedition to the Banyan Kara Ulla range. No "Peking Academy of Pre-
History" ever existed”.

It is correct that the existence of the Professor cannot be verified. But it is safe to assume
that a Department for Pre-History existed within the Academy of Sciences.

2. Early Sources. The earliest mention of the story is in Erich von Damiens infamous
1968 book, Chariots of the Gods. The book has been widely criticized as unreliable; in
fact, the vast majority of names and sources appearing in the book cannot be
corroborated, and no existence of the following Soviet or Chinese scholars can be found
anywhere outside this story: Cho Pu Tei, Tsum Um Nui, Ernst Wagener, Vyatcheslav
Saizev, and Sergei Lolladoff. Most tellingly, Daniken gives his main source for the story
as a Soviet science fiction writer Alexander Kazantsev; however Kazantsev himself
disagrees with Daniken's account and says that it was Daniken who told him the story,
not the other way around.

Not only is Danikens name misspelled, but the Dropa Stones are actually mentioned in
Danikens book “Return to the Stars”. Furthermore, it is not true that Danikens books first
mention the Dropa Stones, as we will see soon. Nevertheless hoards of Skeptics continue
to say that they were first mentioned in his books. Neither is it true that Ernst Wegerer
(also misspelled) did not exist.

3. Later Sources. The 1978 book Sungods in Exile "edited" by David Agamon, appeared
to lend support to the story of the Dropa, but Agamon admitted in the magazine Fortean
Times in 1988 that the book was fiction and that its alleged author, a British researcher
named Dr. Karyl Robin-Evans, was imaginary. Some websites claim to show a photo of
Dr Robin-Evans with the Dalai Lama. A frail, old man assisted by the current Dalai
Lama, the photograph is quite recent and can not be Dr Robin-Evans -- he died in 1978,
according to Hartwig Hausdorf.

It is correct that the entire book is unverifiable. Skeptics used the book to not only refute
the story in general but to also to say that no race of dwarves exist in the region. As we
will see, this too is untrue.

4. Translation. There is absolutely no precedent for an unknown language being

successfully deciphered. All lost ancient languages have been rediscovered only because
they survived in forms familiar to scientists. Even in such cases, deciphering and
understanding these older language forms and their scripts has usually taken decades for
multiple teams of highly competent linguists, and their findings are constantly being
debated and updated. Many ancient scripts (notably Linear A from the island of Crete
and Rongorongo from Easter Island), have defied deciphering precisely because they
cannot be linked to any known language. Given these facts, there would be even greater
difficulties in translating a truly extraterrestrial language. It is therefore highly unlikely
that a single Chinese scholar with no reported background in linguistics could single-
handedly decipher an alien script or language in his spare time.

5. The Disks. All that exists of the supposed alien disks are several wide-angle
photographs. The disks photographed, firstly, do not match the described "12-inch
disks"; the disks photographed are very large. Secondly, the photos show none of the
supposed deep grooves. Finally, absolutely no photos, descriptions, analyses or any other
evidence of the actual 'alien script' appear anywhere at all.
Early rebuttals claimed that there were no such things as ancient discs in China, much
less buried with bodies. Those who said as much must have been ignorant of the
thousands of discs found at burial sties not under the label “dropa stones” but Pi-Discs.

6. The Evidence. The disks were supposed to be stored in several museums in China.
None of these museums have any traces of these disks, nor can any be found of the ones
supposedly sent to USSR for analysis.

7. The Dropa Tribe. While reported to be a tribe of feeble dwarfs, in actuality the Dropas
are nomadic herders who inhabit most of the northern Tibetan Plateau. The Ham are
also inhabitants of Tibet, and traditionally have supplied Tibet's warriors: many of the
13th Dalai Lama's bodyguards during his escape from the Chinese invasion were Ham
Tibetans. The word "Dropa", according to Creighton, describes the nomadic residents of
Tibetan highlands, and can be roughly translated as "solitude" or "isolated".
Furthermore, Creighton described the Dropa as not resembling "troglodytes", or as
stunted; on the contrary, they tend to be rather large and sturdy, befitting their
occupation as herders.

It is true that the Dropka (spoken with a “k”) are a nomadic tribe of Tibet. This does not
rule out the existence of a race of dwarves.

In reviewing the subject I could not help but sigh at the ridiculousness of both Deniers
and Believers of the story. The Believers simply copy the entire thing verbatim into their
books and websites without any additional research or attempt at verification. Some add
their own unfounded speculations to the mix. Skeptics simply copy or link to point-by-
point rebuttals as the one just shown, without questioning it or noticing that at least half
of it is not even true.

It is true that neither the 1938 Expedition nor the existence of the scientists can be
verified. Some argue that this knowledge was lost in the 1966 “Cultural Revolution” of
China, but that’s nothing to go by.

We owe much thanks to the Historian Dr. Jorg Dendl of Berlin. It was his persistent
digging into obscure territory that uncovered some unexpected verifications of the Dropa-
Story. First he found an earlier mention of the story as far back as 1962. Of all places he
found it in a German Language Magazine for Vegetarians (“Das Vegetarische
Universum”). In their July 1962 Edition they carried an article entitled “UFOs in
Prehistory?” based on Russian and Chinese sources. This is interesting because it
corresponds with the time the Professor is said to have deciphered the language.
After this was made public, others quickly found an even earlier version of the story in a
1960s issue of the Russian Magazine “Sputnik”. The story originating from a Russian
Magazine would seem to make Danikens claim that a Russian told him the story, more
likely. And since Russia was the only country back then, that was atop of various news
and rumours of China it would only make sense that the story appears there.

In any case this is a wonderful example of how Skeptics (or should I say Pseudoskeptics),
in their bias, are complicit in spreading false information. The story neither originated in
1978 nor 1970!

Dr. Dendl found more. He dug up a 1933 newspaper report about a Chinese confrontation
with a dwarf-sized tribe in the Bayan-Kara-Ula area! The article relates how a small
woman was being escorted by Chinese soldiers and that their group was being held as
slaves and tortured by Chinese military. Chinese authorities justified the torture with
them being “cannibals”, but this could just as well have been propaganda to justify their
mistreatment. (And this may be the actual reason the story was covered-up!).

So let’s recap: Daniken relays the story in two of his books, not as a fact but as something
he was told. Nevertheless he is later “exposed as a fraud”, a label that denigrates his
reputation as a researcher of ancient astronauts. Years later David Agamon writes a book
on it of which he later admits that he made it up, further tarnishing the reputation of the
story.
Then, Jorg Dendl actually finds hard evidence to back the story up. A few years later, in
1995, authorities are forced to admit to the existence of a dwarf-like race in exactly that
region. Contrary to Debunkers earlier assertions the existence of the Dwarves has
meanwhile even been confirmed by the mainstream press. According to an AP news alert
of November 1995 a “Village of Dwarfs” had been discovered in the Sichuan Province
only a few hundred kilometres away from the Dropa-Cave. One newspaper report
speculated that “environmental pollution” is to blame for their size. A Chinese
ethnologist claimed that their dwarfism was due to high concentrations of mercury in the
soil and that this had poisoned their drinking water (This was later refuted as nonsense by
other scientists who pointed out that mercury would lead to immediate death). The tallest
person of the village was 1.15 meters (three foot, ten inches) and the smallest 63.5 meters
(two foot one inch). What is the most fascinating about this is that I could not find a
single mainstream-news mention of them after this time. One would think that such a
news item would gain more interest. (2)

Clearly, at least part of the story has a basis in reality. Ancient Stone Discs indeed
existed. A dwarf-like race was found in the region but news of it hushed-up. Despite this,
Skeptics in their journals and blogs still maintain that the entire story is false and that the
case is closed.

Of course all this does not mean that there were ancient aliens from Sirius who crashed
their (but who are we to say that the tribe does not believe that that’s where they came
from? Many ancient tribes say they originate from the stars).

Because of the new evidence the Dropa-Story was revived in the 90s bestselling book
“The Chinese Roswell” by German Researcher Hartwig Hausdorf. According to
Hausdorf Chinese authorities have yet to allow any foreigners or researchers access to the
area. Last but not least, Tibetan and Chinese legend has no scarcity of stories of dwarves.
One example only:

Fu Xing: The Chinese God of Happiness, one of the San-xing. He is most frequently
portrayed in the blue clothes of a civil servant and in the company of children, or in his
symbolic form of a bat. His name means "Lucky Star". He is frequently confused with
Tian-guan, the Ruler of Heaven. According to tradition, Fu-xing was a 6th century
government official by the name of Yang Cheng from the village of Dao-zhou. All the
people from this village were of extremely short stature. Every year, the emperor would
summon a large number of people to his court, because he loved to surround himself by
dwarfs. The population of this village reduced greatly over the years. Yang Cheng
addressed a petition to the emperor asking him to show consideration for the people of
his home town. The emperor was so moved by this petition that he never again summoned
them to his court. There are other historical personalities to whom the functions of Fu-
xing are ascribed. One is the 8th-century general Gou Zi-yi who saved the Tang Dynasty
from destruction after an uprising. When the Heavenly Weaver appeared to him, he asked
her to grant him fame and fortune. She replied that he himself was the god of wealth. (7)

(1) Teng Shu-Ping / The Original Significance of Bi-Discs, 2000

(2) Hartwig Hausdorf / The Chinese Roswell
(3) Philip Coppens / The Dropa Tribe and their Stones Revisited (Nexus Magazine)
(4) Cambridge University Press / Ancient Mesoamerica
(5) Erich von Daniken / Return to the Stars
(6) dailygrail.com/node/7078
(7) pantheon.org/articles/f/fu-xing.html