On a side note, many years ago when I was living in Chicago, I first made the acquaintance of Sutherland in a roundabout way: I was asked by a local casting agency to stand in for Billy Baldwin on Flatliners – a job I unfortunately had to turn down due to prior commitments. However, I did visit the set during a rather spooky scene, filmed, no less on Halloween at a cemetery on North Clark St. It was the scene where Sutherland reveals the grave of a childhood acquaintance he teased. So, from midnight in a graveyard, flash-forward thirteen years to just before noon in a hotel room. Suthlerland, wearing a dark-gray sweater, and sipping a glass of water, looks most content. (Please note: In regard to his commentary about Phone Booth, this interview took place a few weeks prior to the events in the Washington DC area.)
Now let's let Mr. Sutherland have his say...
Q: 24, considered the hottest show on TV... There's a lot of anticipation for the premiere. You guys are taking a chance, since your premiere is going to be commercial-free.
SUTHERLAND: Actually Ford's taking a big chance. They're paying for it.
Q: How do you feel about the premiere being commercial-free?
SUTHERLAND: We're excited about it. Thing is, we've been disappointed when it's not commercial free.
Its success in England was phenomenal. It was the biggest show the BBC has ever had. It was the number one DVD there; knocked off Lord of the Rings, which is unheard of for a television show DVD to actually knock-out every feature DVD available. And that's because they showed it without commercials. Stephen Hopkins, who directed the thing has never made television before. I've never made television before. It's one of the funniest things I've ever seen. The two of us took a look at it and went, um, okay, you're right, go with it, this is good. And we went to the premiere, and they did a fantastic party the night it aired. And we're sitting there watching. And I was like, well, okay, that went well. That played okay. Boom! A commercial came on and Stephen was stilted for a moment. He looked over his shoulder and said [in an English Accent] 'I'd like a double Vodka on the Rocks.' And I said, 'I'll have what he's having.' We've never done television before. We'd forgotten that they were going to put commercials in it. And so, what we thought moved like a bullet kinda went [downward hands] like this. And so, obviously we're very excited for them to show it like this. And eventually I think it's going to be the way of television. I don't exactly know now they're going to figure out how to advertise, 'cause they will. Whether it's product-placement within the show itself. I know we're driving Fords this year, and a lot of them. But no, we're grateful to Ford for doing it. And, you know, I always think it's fantastic when you show the World Cup and they do that commercial-free. And I'm grateful that, at least for the first hour, we get to do that here as well.
Q: Were they talking about doing 36 or 42 instead of 24 for a while?
SUTHERLAND: No, because I think at some point someone's going to sleep. I think they were very smart. Our show starts a year-and-a-half after the last day, and the day starts out, and it still tracks a day-and-a-half later. Father and daughter are still dealing with the loss of the wife and expectant mother, and the show picks up from there. So there's still... because of the ending of last season... this deep core that connects both days together. But, you know, there certainly had to be a time separation.
Q: Do you think the show benefits from you guys not having done television?
SUTHERLAND: I certainly do. I know the show benefited from Stephen Hopkins having not done television before. ... And this is one of the problems with television, network television specifically – there are limitations. There are creative limitations by virtue of standards and practices, although they are shifting greatly, those limitations still do exist. Stephen wasn't aware of them, so he just rode right over them. I mean, the idea of creating those boxes I thought was ingenious, and that was not in the script, that was Stephen Hopkins. He created the style that I'm watching them use now that utilizes commercials, music videos, and... I think I saw it on the news the other day... where they actually, instead of just showing... you know... they go over the journalists' shoulder and then to the interviewee – they actually have them both in boxes talking to each other. It was like [Kiefer gives a bewildered look] and I've only seen that as a direct result of Stephen Hopkins' style and the way he shot 24 and made it work. So yeah, Stephen approached the show completely open, with the limitations, and without having been beaten-up like so many television directors I believe have been over the years. 'No, you have to do it this way, etc.' Stephen approached it completely free.
Q: What was your response to 24's finale? It took such a turn...
SUTHERLAND: (heavy sigh) It was hard, I mean, on so many levels. First off, from the show's perspective – good on them. They lived true to what we needed and started out to do. Which was if you expect that we're going to live by the conventions of any television show and you think any single person, myself included, is safe on this show, you're wrong. They will go to incredible lengths to shock you. That's what the show is, and that's what we do. So, good for them. On a personal level, I lost my right hand. Leslie Hope I think is one of the most incredible actors in the world. She's a friend. And she had the other story line, and I never had to worry about that. Literally, it got to a point where I could start reading my own stuff, and not even worry abut what her stuff was. Because I knew we were safe. And so I, you know, selfishly lost someone that I cared about working with very much. So that was very disappointing. But for the show, yeah... no one saw that coming. And I like that. I like it a lot.
Q: Following in the confines of the script for Phone Booth.... Did you really have to stick to the script?
SUTHERLAND: Yes. Absolutely.
Q: How did it all come about?
SUTHERLAND: It was a very funny situation. I'd actually known about the film for quite a long time. I actually didn't know it had gotten made. Joel called me up, who I had worked with a lot of times before, many times before. He phoned and said, 'Hey, I just wanted to call you and see if you'd be interested. And I said, 'Yes.' And he said, 'Let me finish my sentence.' He said, 'I just did a film with Colin Farrell and Forrest Whitaker.' And I said, 'Yes.' He said, 'Shut up! I did a film called Phone Booth.' I said, 'Oh, I know it.' He said, 'Well, have a read. It's the voice.' I said, 'Obviously.' I read it, and reread it. And went in to do the film. And one of the most amazing things – because it's such a unique position, this is not an animated movie. This is a live-action film.
I walked in, sat, and said, 'OK, what kind of voice do you want me to do? What register do you want? How fast do you want him? Now, what are you thinking?' We had this little conversation. 'So, why don't you put up the first couple of cues and let's have a look at it.' And I solely meant to look that the first few cues, and say, 'OK, well let me try this.' And I remember looking at Joel in the booth and he said, 'I'm going to let it run.' And he let it run. And I basically watched the whole movie.
Q: Colin Farrell's performance in it was so breathtaking.
SUTHERLAND: And I actually just met him today, and we had a spot of lunch together. And I remember saying to him, 'I don't know if someone had offered me this if I'd have taken it, if I'd have had the courage.' Because it's ultimately a one-man show, for so much of the film until Forrest comes in. And he is not only physically confined to a very small space, but the range of emotion that he actually has to hit, from anger to betrayal, frustration, self-loathing, pity, self-pity, and be almost crazy in his sense of humor, in a very odd way. As an actor, I can't impress upon you enough how difficult that is. I watched it and I was so blown away by his performance.
I was at that moment – and I had already agreed to do the picture – that I thought this has got to be the luckiest year of my life, because 24 was doing really well at the time, and then, all of a sudden I just kind of walked in. And now I get to be able to tell my kids I was part of this film as well.
He had accomplished everything before I ever walked on that soundstage. How he did that, I have no idea.
They had an actor who read the lines. I don't know who that was. And the left, in the cut, tail-ends and front-ends, so that I would have some room to move. But literally, it was like watching a great lead guitar player, and then all of a sudden the base player comes in, and they just needed the drummer to kind of fill in the holes. And as long as I didn't get in the other two guys' way – and Rhada Mitchell is wonderful as well – we can make this work. He delivers a performance that I think is astonishing.
Q: How did he get you to do it?
SUTHERLAND: Joel has these photos of something that I did a long time ago (laughs). I trust Joel. In my younger career I did Stand By Me for Rob Reiner, then I did The Lost Boys for Joel. I went back and did A Few Good Men with Rob. Did Flatliners and A Time to Kill with Joel. And I basically bounced between those two guys and a guy named Joe Roth, a producer. And I just trusted them. And as a young person, I didn't have a lot of trust. It was very scary, always questioning my own ability and I was very scared of who I was working with, and so, I just always trusted Joel. There was a very funny story on Flatliners. When I first read Flatliners and I agreed to do it, I was doing a picture in England, and I thought 'Oh, this is interesting. It's...' and in my head I thought it was going to be a medical version of Paper Chase – very intelligent students and they were trying this experiment and it was going to be very realistic. And we would do it like that. And then I found myself on the soundstage at Columbia Studios and I was running by the Statue of Liberty's head, and I went, 'Oh my God. I can't do this.' I remember looking at Joel and saying, 'I can't do this. ... None of this makes sense. We're trying to revive a guy over a wind-grate that airs its stuff – the air is so un-sterile. No doctor would ever do this. This is the dumbest thing I've ever seen. I can't do this.' And he said, 'Trust me. Just take a deep breath.' And he put his hand around my shoulder and said, 'If you don't think I'm aware that your career is in my hands, you're wrong. I'm very aware of it. Take a deep breath. You alright? Okay. You'll be fine. You're just going to have to trust me.' And I did. And that is why I would always work for Joel. I trust him.
Q: This performance – you had to strike an interesting balance. Doing something that's repulsive, threatening – and you interest us... keep us wondering what is going on...
SUTHERLAND: I think of the killing as a metaphor. I mean, in the concept of the picture. What this guy is doing is he's basically saying, 'I've been a normal Joe my entire life and I've been held accountable for everything I've ever had to do. And you people are going to now be held accountable too.' It's no different than what I see in the United States when I watch people talk about the Enron scandal. They want those people held accountable for it. These people that make the billions and billions of dollars and have ripped us off non-stop and charged us more power, etc. These people are going to be held accountable. This guy is a guy who says, 'No, you're not a bad guy, but you are going to be held accountable for what you've done in your life. You're going to be held accountable for the way you've behaved. You're going to be held accountable for the way you treat people. You're going to be held accountable for your dishonesty.' And the worst part of it was, as I was doing the picture, I liked the character more and more and more. And I saw more of myself in Colin Farrell's character, which was the other really disturbing part. And the weirdest thing was that at some point I thought, now I almost wanted someone to clean my slate as well. There was an interesting moment where I thought wouldn't it be a relief if every lie I've ever told just got revealed and everything that I've ever revealed and everything that I've ever done wrong just got revealed. And I could just start over. And, as terrible as this guy's two-hour ordeal is, there was a part of me that thought, well, uh, it's a tough two hours, but it'd be pretty nice to actually wipe all of that away. For me, twenty-five years of... I'm a rascal. Crap, just washed away.
Q: Here's your chance...
SUTHERLAND: Yeah. I said, 'Wouldn't it be neat?'
Q: Were you trying different things or was the whole idea just to be straight-on menacing?
SUTHERLAND: I didn't want him necessarily to be menacing because there are a lot of ways to do it. What I wanted him to do was to be in control. And, I find that when someone is actually in control, they're calm, they're deliberate, they're focused, and succinct. I wanted him, within the framework that I had to work in – it wasn't like I just got to read it like and animated film and then they draw the character – this was already done. This was already cut, and so I tried to create a voice that was that – that was in control. And only towards the end do you start to hear my character lose it on any level. So, it wasn't so much menacing that I was trying to go after, but it was control from a voice that you don't ever see, which becomes menacing very quickly. Certainly in this circumstance.
Q: Did you just recently play Gauguin?
SUTHERLAND: Yes.
Q: It's not the first historical character you've played. What elements go into it... research...
SUTHERLAND: A lot. I mean, for me I did a lot. I read two fantastic books. One called Tale of the Wolf. And one was – I apologize, I'm not remembering the title, but it had a fantastic biography on him as well, and then I watched films. It was very funny. My father did a fantastic picture about Gauguin. I watched that. Talked to painters. And very quickly I got, for myself at least, a perception of who I thought he was. What I was interested in, which was not where I'm very well educated or versed, is how his paintings affected painters and what it meant. Picasso thought [Gauguin] was the greatest painter that had ever lived. And not necessarily for his painting skills, but for what he chose to do intellectually. I talked to a lot of painters about how he affected them. And, in the end, the one thing that I derived from Paul Gauguin was this was a man who was very aware of trying to create his own legacy, not only while he was alive, but certainly knew that in death it would matter. And that was a very big deal to him. And that was in a lot of his letters back to his wife, Mette. He felt his calling was in fact to that legacy, more than any single thing in his life, his wife, his children, and even his painting. His legacy was more in trying to change painting from what we know versus photography and trying to make it much more of an intellectual interpretation of what you see.
Q: Paul Gauguin – sick? A drunk? A jerk?
SUTHERLAND: He was. I blamed it on the absinthe. (Laugh) No, he was very arrogant. He was incredibly charming. And I think you have to be a son-of-a-bitch if you're going to be told you're awful your entire life and still dedicate you life to doing what you're doing, and know that it' won't be realized until you're dead. There's incredible arrogance in that, and most truly arrogant people are sons-of-bitches.