I can’t work without my ADHD meds

06th March 2024

bbc.co.uk/accessall

Access All – episode 94

Presented by Emma Tracey

EMMA-           Hello, Tanyalee Davis.

TANYALEE-   Hello!

EMMA-           Okay, so you’re a little person, you’re 3ft something.

TANYALEE-   Three.

EMMA-           3ft 3. I didn’t actually measure you though. I found that out from your TikTok profile.

TANYALEE-   I’m the Guiness Book world record holder now for the shortest comedian at 3ft 3 inches tall.

EMMA-           Amazing. You are going to be on with me later for a nice chat. But something’s popped up that I wanted to talk to you about, right. There is a pub in Abingdon, Oxfordshire called The Midget. Would you go in there?

TANYALEE-   Absolutely.

EMMA-           Why?

TANYALEE-   I’d be taking pictures outside.

EMMA-           Why? [Laughter]

TANYALEE-   First of all I don’t get offended by the term midget. It doesn’t bother me. I’ve gotten flak from other little people because I use the term in my act. But I’m a firm believer if you don’t give words power then they can’t hurt you, so that’s my take on it. And there used to be, like, the baseball league or the hockey league the adult version; the younger version were called the midget leagues. So, the definition is usually a smaller version of something. Back in the day the little people of America used to be called the midgets of America. The term midget itself is not a derogatory term; it’s just it’s been taken on board by little people because, you know, when you’re being called the midget, the midget, midget, midget all the time, you know, it takes on a negative connotation. So, I understand where that comes from. Personally it doesn’t bother me.

EMMA-           So, there’s a petition started by Dr Erin Pritchard and they nearly have 1,000 signatures on this petition, which is to rename this pub. Well, Dr Erin Pritchard sent us a message telling us why she thinks that the pub’s name should be changed:

ERIN-              I started the petition because I’m a person with dwarfism. I’m also an academic with dwarfism and an expert on the subject. This term is offensive to most or the majority of people with dwarfism, okay, it’s a slur. It was derived from the Freak Show. Now, let’s face it, you wouldn’t want to put any other disabled person on display, would you? And it’s derived from the word midge, meaning gnat or sandfly, so it’s a very dehumanising word. So, why does anybody think that The Midget is okay?

EMMA-           Green King, the company who own the pub, sent us a statement. They said that the pub is named after the MG Midget car, which was produced in the Abingdon area over the years; it’s no longer in production. But that they are an inclusive company that welcomes everybody, so they are going to reassess the name.

                       Okay, we’ll say it together, one, two, three: on with the show!

MUSIC-           Theme music.

EMMA-           Hello. You’re listening to Access All, the BBC’s weekly podcast about disability and mental health. I’m Emma Tracey, and on this week’s show, you’ve already heard her voice, but we’ll be hearing more from comedian and TikTok sensation, Tanyalee Davis. We’ll also be speaking to Henry Shelford from ADHD UK about the shortage of medication used to manage ADHD and the trouble it’s causing for people in their jobs.

                       If you like what you hear please subscribe to us on BBC Sounds or wherever you get your podcasts from, particularly if you’ve caught us on 5 Live in the middle of the night – very welcome to you, thank you for being here. And you can also get in touch with us, email [email protected].

                       Now, many of you may have heard about the shortages of medication used to manage symptoms around ADHD, Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. ADHD can cause loss of concentration and can stop you from focusing on a particular task for any length of time. Now, up to 5% of children in the UK could have ADHD, and about 3% of adults. There has been a shortage of some of the drugs used to help manage aspects of the condition in the UK and internationally since September last year, and one medication in particular, Elvanse. The government said that the situation would be resolved by the end of last year, but that’s not happened, and now they’re saying that it will be April this year; so still a month or two away. That’s not much comfort for people who rely on medication to work. Like Cerys Rees, who’s with my now. Hi, Cerys.

CERYS-           Hi.

EMMA-           How are you doing today?

CERYS-           I’m okay, yeah, not bad.

EMMA-           That’s good to hear. Thank you for coming on to talk about this. I mean, it must be a very tricky subject for you. Can you tell me a little bit about yourself and what you do for a job?

CERYS-           So, I’m a youth worker and I work with young people who are affected by homelessness, and also young people who are impacted by serious youth violence. So, I work with young people in custody and out in the community, and we support young people with accommodation amongst various other things.

EMMA-           Wow, that’s a really responsible and worthwhile job it sounds like. But what impact has not having your ADHD medication had on your ability to do that job?

CERYS-           Oh, tremendous, like, so much. I was starting to become really late for work, losing things. I was focusing on so many different things but not just one thing, so I was never completing tasks. Just managing, because we juggle a lot of things in terms of my work, so I was finding it difficult to juggle those things really.

EMMA-           Why, what does the medication do? What does it help with?

CERYS-           Do you know what, the first time when I ever took Elvanse my mind just went so quiet and I didn’t have all the sort of background stuff in my head, and I was able to focus on one thing and one task.

EMMA-           It’s made a massive difference to your life?

CERYS-           100%, yes.

EMMA-           What do you think is the lowest, the worst point for you in this whole situation?

CERYS-           I was a week and a half without any medication at all, and that’s when I remember my manager coming to speak to me to say that I was being a bit more difficult in meetings and things and that I was short with my colleagues. I had a lack of focus and I wasn’t really completing anything, like seeing a thing the whole way through, if that makes sense.

EMMA-           Uh-huh.

CERYS-           So, the point where I didn’t feel I was capable of doing my job anymore, a job that I absolutely love. Because with the medication it helps you, like, keep up on the same level as your colleagues, and because I didn’t have the medication I found that really difficult. And I was thinking as well of, you know, resigning and handing in my notice because I didn’t feel that it was fair the way that I was and things I was struggling with, that I was giving enough to the young people I was working with.

EMMA-           What has your employer’s response been to the trouble you’ve been having?

CERYS-           They have been supportive, and I’ve been really, really lucky.

EMMA-           Is the situation improving do you think? Is there less of a shortage now?

CERYS-           I’m still struggling to get Elvanse, so I don’t think it is improving. And I’m really, really worried about it continuing on like this because it’s so stressful.

EMMA-           It sounds it. I can hear it in your voice, Cerys.

CERYS-           Yeah.

EMMA-           Thank you so much for telling me your story.

CERYS-           Thank you.

EMMA-           Others have been in touch about this as well. Darren O’Connor, who’s a software engineer in London, sent us this voice message:

DARREN-        So, the shortage started for me in July when I put in a request for my usual prescription and I didn’t hear anything for three months. And then finally in November it was cancelled out of the blue with no explanation. And I’ve pretty much continuously been off of work since then, which at first was okay because my employer was understanding and has a good sickness policy where I was still getting paid for up to six months. But now I’m currently on zero income and just burning through my savings. For me medication has been like a lifesaving crutch. Having to go this long without the medication it's, you know, very challenging.

EMMA-           Gosh, that’s really affecting. You can hear in his voice as well how stressed he is about not having medication either. Darren’s quite the highflyer actually; he was earning £150,000 a year previously and working at companies like Google. And here’s another email from someone who has asked to remain anonymous, and you’ll soon understand why:

ANON-        In September 2023 I went off work with stress and anxiety linked to my ADHD and the worries around medication. I approached my then employers about possible work adjustments while my medication had changed and other options that could potentially help support during that time. They said they would not be able to accommodate my requests. In January I was asked to leave the company with a settlement. They said that if I didn’t take the settlement I would be taken through medical capability proceedings. I thought being open about my ADHD diagnosis would be the right thing to do, and the company I work for would be supportive. However, I was wrong. I was made to feel ashamed about asking for help. Sadly at the moment I don’t have the courage or the confidence to put myself in the spotlight. One day I hope to tell my story without feeling the shame of my ADHD.

EMMA-           Henry Shelford from ADHD UK is with me now and has been listening to all of the stories that we’ve heard so far. Have you heard a lot of stories as well, Henry? What have you been hearing in your job?

HENRY-          Yeah, I mean, it’s been brutal. We did a large-scale survey, a couple of thousand people, and the vast majority said they were struggling in work. Circa 40% said they worried about losing their job, and one in 20 saying they had lost their job. And I’ve certainly spoken to people who have. I spoke to somebody who not only their job but entire career. They had been given an ADHD medication with the issues they’ve had, given a different one, told it would be very similar. It wasn’t. Their problems came back again. And their boss just essentially came to them and said, “Look, we talked about this, you said this was sorted, it’s not. We can’t do this again. You’re out” and that was it.

EMMA-           Which must be so difficult for people’s mental health and their confidence as well. you have ADHD as well, Henry, how have you been impacted by this situation around the shortage of medication?

HENRY-          I’ve felt that this is the moment I need to be able to step up to be the strongest, the best I can be, and at the same time I’m being chipped away by the same problems. You know, my prescription has just been with the pharmacy now and it’s just expired, so it’s been in for 28 days and they haven’t been able to fill it and it’s expired. So, it’s continuing to impact me directly.

EMMA-           So, do you have any medication at the moment?

HENRY-          I do, but I’m getting to the end. And honestly, I don’t know quite what I’m going to do. I’ve been very fortunate so far, I haven’t had to ration and I’ve been able to get medication of different strengths, but some medication. Honestly, I’m very worried. We were told that this should be over by April. And actually I was told that this was going to be pretty much over by now, and that really April was a long stop date just in case. And we’re still seeing huge, huge problems and yeah, I’m very worried about it.

EMMA-           And the media has been describing it, like I just did earlier, production issues they’re saying, they’re saying it’s around more and more people being put on ADHD medication. Can you give us any more insight than that?

HENRY-          Yeah, certainly the sort of blaming people for getting a diagnosis and that there been more people is just absolutely outrageous. You don’t see that in other things. Literally in a paper quite recently one page was a celebration of more people getting HRT medication and a celebration of that. A few pages along, there’s more people on ADHD medication, this is terrible! You’re like, what is this? We get blamed for being diagnosed. If you look at the statistics, the growth of need on ADHD medication was very stable. Any manufacturer manages that. And to just…I thought it was an outrageous undermining and slur to blame us for a diagnosis and say it’s our fault, too many people have got a diagnosis, we’ve run out of meds. It’s just ludicrous.

What has actually happened is the main manufacturer of ADHD medication only has two factories, one for North America, the other for the whole of the rest of the world. North America has its own trouble, and the one for the whole of the rest of the world has had a failure on its manufacture in its packaging. Where packaging means the right amount of medication in each pill, and the right number of pills in each bottle. And it’s catastrophically failed. And as a result they’ve not been able to make the medication that we need, and that’s the reason for the crisis. It is a manufacturing failure, and it’s a failure of a pharmaceutical company not to have distributed manufacturing so it didn’t have all its eggs in one basket, leaving us to be the pieces that get broken as a result.

EMMA-           This doesn’t sound like something the government can fix. What are you expecting them to do?

HENRY-          Well, pharmaceuticals do have stock issues every now and again, it happens and, you know, they can’t fix that. But they could actually put some things in place to support us. At the moment we have no support around what to do with the sudden loss of medication. What we’re saying to people is don’t fire people, don’t remove people from the school, don’t exclude them, and this is a short-term problem. The government could put more resource in place for schools; it could say we shouldn’t be excluding pupils with ADHD struggling without their medication.

EMMA-           So, they could give some guidance?

HENRY-          I expect absolutely nothing from the government because they’ve given us absolutely nothing so far.

EMMA-           And what’s your best advice, Henry, for someone with ADHD who can’t get their medication and is struggling at work?

HENRY-          Well, it’s incredibly tough. Lots of people haven’t spoken to their work about it. Step one is to speak to them.

EMMA-           So, speak to your employer, that’s one thing.

HENRY-          Speak to your employer, talk to them, look to get understanding. Look to get support, try and build a package of support and where are you struggling, what can you do. Look to Access to Work which is a support package from the government; but the wait time is five months. We’ve asked the government to accelerate that for people struggling with the medication crisis, and the government already has a fast-track scheme: if you’re new to the job you’ll be seen within a couple of weeks. We’d like to see that applied to people with ADHD. The main thing in terms of talking to bosses one thing we’re asking is just please don’t fire people. This is a short-term problem, help people through it, don’t fire them.

EMMA-           Henry, thank you. You and everybody else we’ve spoken to have sounded so disheartened and anxious about this. I’ve really heard it in all of your voices. Henry Shelford from ADHD UK thank you so much for talking to me.

HENRY-          Thank you.

EMMA-           Takeda, the company that produces Elvanse, told us:

TAKEDA-        We are anticipating that there will be intermittent disruption across our ADHD products into April 2024. For full clarity, this does not mean that no stock is available until April 2024, but the supply will be available on an intermittent basis.

EMMA-           The Department of Health and Social Care said:

DHSC-             We have well established processes to prevent, manage and mitigate medicine shortages to ensure patients can continue to access the treatments they need. We are working with the industry to help resolve remaining issues as soon as possible, and have issued advice to healthcare professionals. Any patient who is worried about their condition should speak to their clinician.

EMMA-           You are the lifeblood of Access All, honestly you are. Yes, you, you are. You who’s listening in the shower or on the way to an appointment or in your bed or in your kitchen or whatever. And we absolutely love it when you get in touch with your emails and your posts on social media, and your voice messages. We love a voice message. And Lizzy sent us one. And Lizzy had been listening to our discussion about Primark’s adaptive underwear range. Basically it’s knickers and bras that are easier to take off and easier to get on, if you find those things tricky. Lizzy wanted to tell us about a solution to another problem that certain underwear can help with:

LIZZY-            Hi, BBC Access All, it’s Lizzy Jones again. I just recently saw the story that you ran about Primark’s accessible clothing. And first of all I wanted to say that I bloomin’ love Primark, I love the fact that the end till is always accessible for disabilities; you just have to go to that end rather than queue up. I can always get round in my wheelchair. The main thing though I wanted to just sort of say, because I’m not sure everybody’s thought about it, I saw about this accessible underwear, and at the moment that’s not something I need right now, but who knows. What was interesting though in Primark is their period pants, which are ever so comfortable anyways for when you’re on your monthlies. They also are good at catching low levels of incontinence if you have that kind of an issue. And they’re not boring either. So, it’s better than going and buying the big plastic pants; it’s greener for the environment. And the other thing it’s quite discreet because they’re labelled as period pants, so you don’t necessarily feel like you stick out. So, I just thought other people might want to know.

EMMA-           I think other people will want to know that, Lizzy. I just can’t tell you how much I love when a disabled person drops us a message with a tip that’s going to help so many other people. So, thank you so much for that, Lizzy Jones.

                       Now, on the day that her book Mad Woman was released Bryony Gordon, bestselling author, came in and she talked to us about lots of things, mansplaining in medical settings, but she also talked about binge eating disorder:

[Clip]

BRYONY-       I was eating vast, vast – and we’re not talking about, you know, a packet of biscuits or a bar of chocolate – vast, vast amounts of food, sometimes out of the bin. And it was to sort of try and calm myself really. It was the only way I knew, you know, in absence of alcohol, because I’d been sober for, like, two and a half years at that point, I couldn’t pick up a drink so I picked up the food instead. And I look back on it and I have a lot of compassion for myself because in a way I’d rather I picked up the food than the alcohol. But it was really hard, and it was as dark as the last days of my drinking were, you know, the shame, but also yeah, like blacking out, just really just numbing myself to the point of not coming round and just being in food packets.

[End of clip]

EMMA-           Wow. People took to Instagram to tell us how much they could relate to Bryony’s story. Lulu Verse commented that she’s been through something similar herself, but that having voices like Bryony’s makes it feel like a less dark and scary place. “I turned to food to self-medicate when I was in an abusive relationship. I’d gorge myself with food and feel a temporary high”. But then she says she felt a sense of shame, and that she can relate to Bryony so hard.

                       To hear that interview in full with Bryony Gordon search for Access All on BBC Sounds. But don’t do it yet because we’ve got a cracking guest coming up. And if you want to get in touch with us email [email protected]. Or you can send us a voice note, like Lizzy did, please do. Our number is 0330 123 9480, and if you can pop the word Access in text before you send your message that helps your message stand out from messages for all sorts of other podcasts that we get into that number. So, if you pop the word Access before your message that’s going to help us out a lot. We listen to every message and we do read everything you send, but we cannot respond to everything.

                       If you’ve been listening attentively from the very beginning of this podcast episode you will have heard the voice of my guest. And you’ll also know that she is 3ft 3 inches tall. But she’s also a comedian who’s been on the comedy circuit for 30 years, and more recently she’s become a TikTok sensation. And I’m sort of hoping by having her here we’ll get Access All to go viral as well. It’s the absolutely brilliant Tanyalee Davis. Thank you for joining me, Tanyalee.

TANYALEE-   Thank you for having me.

EMMA-           Let’s hear a clip of one of Tanyalee’s most famous TikToks:

[Clip]

TANYALEE-   Okay, so I’m on the plane and the flight attendant just asked me if my seat was FAA approved. I’m like, “What, my scooter?” and she’s like, “No, your seat you’re sitting on”. And I’m like, “You mean, my arse?!”

[End of clip]

EMMA-           You were on an aeroplane, you were sitting on an airline seat, and the flight attendant thought you were on a booster seat?

TANYALEE-   Yes. Because my type of dwarfism I am very short, but I’m shaped like a Dachshund, the wiener dog, so I’m very long-bodied trunk and short arms and short legs. So, when I sit down I am average height. Like you and I sitting side by side we’re shoulder to shoulder. So, when I walked on the aeroplane obviously a little person and a tall person walking onto the aeroplane; then we sit down and we’re literally eye to eye, the woman was convinced that I was on a booster seat. So, when she kept asking if my seat was FAA approved and I was like “Are you asking if my bootie…?”

[Clip]

TANYALEE-   Is my arse approved by the FFA? I’ve got a big arse. It’s FAA approved [laughter].

[End of clip]

MMA-             Tanyalee, you were born in Canada, you’ve lived in the UK for a while, you live in the US at the moment. But you’re back in the UK touring your Tanyalee Unstoppable Me show. What’s that show about?

TANYALEE-   So, it’s called Tanyalee Unstoppable Me, and a lot’s changed since I was last here. I’m a new person, I have a new lease of life. And I guess when you hit a certain age in life a lot of self-reflection. I’m 53 now, and I look back in my life and I see pivotal points in my life. Like my parents being two tall people having a dwarf child they had no idea what I was capable of, so they never limited me, they never told me I could not do something, so I was always encouraged to do everything. So, I played every sport. And growing up in school of course I was bullied, but I always had the determination of I will show you. So, that’s kind of how my life has evolved.

And then when I lived here in the UK I was kind of told every day that I couldn’t: you’re disabled, you can’t do that, why are you by yourself, you’re disabled, you should have a carer. And after about four years of that I kind of I guess believed it. And I didn’t realise that it really beat me down until I was forced with the lockdown to move away and ended up A, having some downtime and just decompressing, but then getting on social media and everybody wanted to talk about my problems and my challenges. And I went, why do you want to talk about my struggles when I’ve done so many incredible things with my life.

                       So, that, the Tanyalee Unstoppable Me mantra was sort of born from that. I realised my entire life I just believed I could. So, the show is basically chronicling my life stories, my adventures around the world, just getting on with it, not making excuses, not having a victim mentality and just having a sense of humour to life’s crazy situations that you come across when you’re in a 3ft 3 inch body travelling around the world. This show is so personal to me. And it’s needed. We need inspiration and we need motivation, and we need to inspire our younger people to want to achieve their personal greatness. Because right now our younger people have a very victim mentality.

EMMA-           Do you think?

TANYALEE-   Oh absolutely!

EMMA-           All younger people or just disabled younger people?

TANYALEE-   No, actually I’m not even thinking about disabled people. I don’t gear my content to disabled people, that’s the thing. I have always played to I guess what we call mainstream audiences. And so therefore if you like at it as a non-disabled person seeing a dwarf they’re just like, oh my gosh, I couldn’t imagine living in your body, right. And then there’s me parasailing and scuba diving and doing all these amazing things, you know, so that’s how I put my content out there.

EMMA-           Disabled people have been doing that for years, these motivational speakers, these disabled blokes climbing mountains. Are you the same as those people climbing mountains [laughs]? Have you gone that way?

TANYALEE-   Well, I guess in a way, inspiration porn they call it, right?

EMMA-           Yeah.

TANYALEE-   But I think it’s necessary right now, I really honestly do, because I know the reaction I get from people. In general people when they see a little person, because I’m doing videos, I go live showing myself cooking and cleaning and doing housework, and people are like, ‘Why are you doing that? Why- isn’t your husband helping you?’ and I’m like, because I’m quite capable of doing it myself.

EMMA-           You feel like you have to do these back to basic videos to…?

TANYALEE-   But I do it with a sense of humour though, this is the thing. I’m not taking it seriously like I’m forcibly trying to shove it down your throats. I’m like, this is my reality, I laugh my way through these hilarious situations. And like the incident on the aeroplane, two weeks after that incident I have a tattoo on my left buttocks that’s a stamp that says FFA Approved.

EMMA-           Just for people who don’t know, what is inspiration porn?

TANYALEE-   It’s a term that people that are climbing mountains and that kind of stuff, the Paralympics, you know, oh look at them, they’re struggling and argh.

EMMA-           So, it’s like people watching disabled people doing things or having a nice cute moment makes them feel better?

TANYALEE-   Yeah.

EMMA-           Or makes them feel all warm and fuzzy.

TANYALEE-   Yeah. In a way I don’t think that’s a bad thing. I mean, recently somebody on Twitter said that I had toxic positivity, which I was like is that a thing, so I’m too happy and it’s making people uncomfortable, so that’s where were are a society. Come on!

EMMA-           But don’t they mean toxic positivity as in positivity even when there isn’t anything to be positive about? Or positivity where it makes other people in similar situations to you wonder, you know, think about why can’t I do that and I feel a bit disappointed in myself that I can’t do that, and why can’t I when she can?

TANYALEE-   It’s not my responsibility on how other people react to my videos. So, if somebody says that first of all my take is wow, how is it possible that we can have too much positivity. That to me is, like, wow, trying to stifle somebody being happy, number one. And number two, if you’re not doing what you can to your best ability then that’s a you problem. Everybody, whether you’re disabled or not, everybody has challenges, everybody has mental health problems, anxiety, depression, because we’re all human beings. But if you focus on one particular either emotion, like depression or anxiety, and you’re just focusing on that all the time then you’re going to lose yourself. You have to find that balance within yourself. But people are so focused now on their mental health problems and stuff like that and they need to kind of think outside of themselves a little bit, realise that you are capable of doing a lot of things despite having anxiety, despite having depression or being disabled or whatever. But I feel like I’m getting backlash. And I’m, like, okay well this obviously because we were brought up different ways. I was empowered my entire life. But after living here I realised that a lot of disabled are not and people are not empowered living over here. I was, like I said, stifled and I felt like I was being…

EMMA-           So, in what way were you stifled? You mentioned train drama, what happened there?

TANYALEE-   Oh good lord! So, I have a mobility scooter, which in this country is not considered a wheelchair.

EMMA-           Because there’s different rules for a scooter than…?

TANYALEE-   Yeah. They think of like these big huge four-wheeler things. Actually in Scotland they said a mobility scooter is an alternative form of public transportation. So, it’s not like I’m going to be driving that on the M1 [laughter], you know. Beep beep. So, it fits quite safely in a train in the wheelchair spot, or on the buses and stuff like that. But they don’t go by a case-by-case situation. So, that. And then just in general, like taxi drivers, if I’m on my scooter trying to get a black taxi they won’t stop. I have to get somebody else to wave the taxi down, I hide, then the taxi stops and I’m like, open the door, and then they’ll open the door and I’ll come springing out. And you can just see the taxi driver like, argh, now I’ve got to get up.

EMMA-           And get the ramp out [laughs].

TANYALEE-   Yeah. They visibly let you know that you’re an inconvenience on the regular in this country I find.

EMMA-           And does that not happen in other countries?

TANYALEE-   No! I mean, I’ve been all over the world and in general, like in the Philippines there’s very little accessibility in the Philippines, but the people are so accommodating. Like, we went on a trip and they got my scooter and we had to get on first it was a coach for hours, then we got out the coach and had to walk across the sand to a boat, get on a boat and then get to an island where we got on a little van, and I had these guys just basically like, ‘Okay, what do you need?’ Pick up the scooter, carry it across, put it up onto the boat, scooped me up the way I needed it and did that. And nobody batted an eye, they just said, ‘How can we help?’

EMMA-           So, you didn’t mind being scooped up?

TANYALEE-   No.

EMMA-           Because you do do jokes about not being picked up.

TANYALEE-   Oh yes, well you’ve got to ask first. You can’t just randomly go picking up little people. That’s a no-no.

EMMA-           Because there’s dwarf tossing, or there was years ago.

TANYALEE-   Well, there’s still in America dwarf wrestling, the Dwarfinators or something. I mean, listen, I’m all about personal choice; if you want to do that and you’re taking the risk, you know, who am I to tell somebody else how to live their life. That’s how I am.

EMMA-           Are you talking about if a dwarf wants to get – a dwarf? I just called someone a dwarf! I don’t do…that’s not what I…

TANYALEE-   But I am a dwarf.

EMMA-           If a little person or whatever they would describe themselves as, chooses to be part of that you’re not judging them?

TANYALEE-   No, absolutely not. I believe being offended is a choice. So, I don’t get caught up on semantics and terminology anymore. I think it’s a waste of energy. And I realise now we live in a culture where everybody’s got to have labels and stuff like that. I’m kind of like whatever, just focus on what you can do [laughs] to be your best, instead of all this other crap.

EMMA-           Shall we talk about your TikTok experience? Why did you decide to go on TikTok in the first place?

TANYALEE-   Well, like many people it happened during the lockdown because I couldn’t do shows, I could not perform. And as a performer – I mean I’d been doing it at that point I was coming  on 30 years, 2020 was my 30th anniversary – so not being able to perform I knew mentally that was going to mess me up. So, I had to be something creative. So, a friend of mine, we spent four months in Norwich when the lockdown happened. So, I started doing dance videos on Facebook and YouTube, just saying, hey everybody, I’m going to put on an ‘80s song, I put on Let’s Get Physical with Olivia Newton-John, I put my pants over my leggings, I put a sweatband on and I just sat there in my steps and bounced around to one song a day, trying to get my endorphins going and trying to inspire other people just to move a little bit because it’ll help with your mental health since we’re all locked down. And I kept getting copyright infringements. So, a friend said, you need to get on TikTok. And I was like, what is this thing called TikTok. So, I did one or two videos, then I put it down.

Then I moved to Florida and did a couple of videos, and I gained that bit of following with my first ever viral video was kind of a joke about The Villages, which is a retirement community near where my parents live, and they have the largest sexually transmitted disease rate of anywhere in the world, this old people community. The joke went viral. So, I was like ah, I can do some of my material on TikTok. So, between that and my dances and then talking about my clothes, it's just been this constant evolution of content.

EMMA-           So, I’m trying a new thing where I ask the same question to all the guests. What is the best or most useful thing that another disabled person has told you or taught you?

TANYALEE-   Well, I would say for me in this country when I first moved here they were like, do you have a radar key. I was like, what is a radar key. And they’re like it’s a key for the toilets. And I was like, really, does a disabled person wake up one morning, like the tooth fairy, and there’s a special little key underneath their pillow and from now on you can use the toilets across the country. So, yeah that was like, talk about opening doors for me, that was very valuable information [laughter]. I was like, okay.

EMMA-           So, this is a key you can buy that opens up a lot of accessible toilet doors in the UK?

TANYALEE-   Yes, which of course I forgot to bring. I had one and I have no idea it is. I lost it many moons. Somebody mentioned it and I go, oh I’m going to be locked out of many toilets now in this country.

EMMA-           And one of the funny things about it is it is an enormous key.

TANYALEE-   Yes, absolutely huge, yes. Might as well be carrying a brick with you.

EMMA-           Tanyalee Davis, it’s been absolutely brilliant having you on. Thank you very much.

TANYALEE-   You’re very welcome. Thank you for having me.

EMMA-           That is it. That is your lot for this episode. Thank you to my guests Tanyalee Davis, Cerys Rees and Henry Shelford, and to everybody whose voices you heard on this podcast. Which leads me to the next thing I wanted to tell you which is that we are nearing our 100th episode. Can you believe it? But we need you to keep getting in touch with us, keep leaving us your messages, because you are what makes this thing tick. And we want to have some great surprises when it comes to episode 100. Watch this space. I’ve no idea what’s going to happen yet. I don’t think anybody does, to be honest.

                       Right, you can keep in touch with us on email [email protected]. You can find us on X, formerly known as Twitter, @BBCAccessAll, and we’re the same handle on Instagram as well. Or you can send us a voice mail, 0330 123 9480. Thanks for listening. Goodbye.

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